TiVo Community Forums Archives - newbie here...questions to help me decide whether to buy or not...

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newbie here...questions to help me decide whether to buy or not...
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Posted by: sledgmb

hi. complete newbie here. don't own a tivo. don't own replay. have a vcr, dvd, xbox, and regular tv.

anyway, my wife and i watch ALOT of tv these days. mostly the reality crap. the stuff is on all the time across alot of channels. i work out of town most of the week so i rely on her to record all the shows i miss during the week. she has to record alot of shows to b/c she's usually doing something while they're on. anyway, with the vcr it's kind of cumbersome.

tivo sounds like just what we need. i don't really have a problem with the cost. but i have a few questions to see if it really fits our needs and i figured the experts hang out here, so here goes...

1) i just have regular cable tv. no cable box whatsoever. it sounds like i can just use a cable splitter and run one cable to the tivo and one cable to the tv in order to watch one show while recording another. am i correct here? will using this splitter degrade my signal any?

2) is it technically possible to buy the tivo and not buy the service? can the tivo be used like a vcr? if so, what is this like? can somebody describe the use of a tivo without the service? if i decide to try out the tivo with monthly service, can i change to lifetime service at some point in the future?

3) i've read the stuff about the season pass feature if you subscribe. how reliable is this really? any problems with it?

4) without the directv tivo, is it technically possible at this time to record 2 shows that are currently on at the SAME time? i.e., say you're not home, but there are 2 shows on from 7pm to 9pm and you want to record them both - is this possible? i'm thinking you would have to have 2 tuners inside the tivo and i don't think that's the case with the series2 tivo's. do you as a community expect this to be a feature of an upcoming version of the tivo?

5) funny one here. i have regular cable. when i moved into my house, i called the cable company and they turned me on. i didn't order any premium channels (hbo, showtime, etc). anyway, the owners that lived there before me must have had hbo b/c i've had it ever since i've been in this house. haven't paid the first $0.01 for it. ever. is it possible for them to be alerted to this when/if i get a tivo and turn on my subscription?

that's all i can think of right now. i'm sure i've got lots of other questions, but these are the main ones. looking for some good answers from you tivo veterans out there.

cheers,
sledgmb

Posted by: martinp13

1) Yes, you can use a splitter, and no, I have mine split three ways and I don't notice any degradation. YMMV (Your mileage may vary).

2) TiVo without the TiVo service (even if it works) is not worth it, don't bother worrying about it.

3) Very reliable, but it's only as good as the user who maintains it and the guide data it gets.

4) No, and no. :)

5) No more than if you didn't have the TiVo.

Welcome to thinking about the TiVolution. :)

Posted by: mdscott

1) Yes that is basically the way to go -- it assumes that your TV has multiple inputs -- but given everything else you list that seems likely. No significant degradation (unless you have a very marginal signal in the first place)

2) Not with any TiVo currently being manufactured; Yes you can switch from monthly to Lifetime any ti9me you want.

3) We have had no problems with Season Passes; If you get your TiVo you will want to look at the differences between Season Passes and Wish Lists. Each schedules future recordings based on user entered criteria but the each work differently.

4) Yes - You could route the split feed through your vcr before it gets to the TV.

5) This could be "passive" cable theft - I have no comments in the area.

mds

Posted by: sledgmb

okay, that brings up a couple more questions...

if i use the splitter so that i can watch 1 program while recording another (which would be frequent), does this completely disable the 30-minute buffer pause feature? would i put the cable into the tivo, and put another cable into the televison. tivo would be recording show #1 of the 1st cable. i'm watching regular television like i never had a tivo off the 2nd cable. is this right? i could use A/V cables (RCA composite) to hook the tivo to the televison. if i wanted to use the buffer/pause feature, i'd just watch television off video input #1? kind of rambled there, but do i have the general idea?

also, mdscott - what you're recommending there is the cable #1 goes first to the tivo. then it goes from the tivo to the vcr. each of these devices could record something on different channels and in this way i could record 2 shows at once while watching a 3rd. is this correct? this may be the last thing i need to figure out before making the decision. it sure would be nice if they included the tuners in the tivo itself - or made that an option.

cheers,
sledgmb

Posted by: Freki

If you split the cable, I would suggest having one cable go to the VCR then to the TV, and the other cable going to the TiVo. Then use the RCA or S-Video outputs on the VCR and the TiVo to connect them to the TV, and to connect TiVo outputs to the VCR inputs. That way you can record shows on both the VCR and the TiVo, and save shows from the TiVo to the VCR in case you want to archive them. Splitting the cable is also nice when you have houseguests who don't know how to use the TiVo - you can just hand them the TV remote, and they can watch TV the way they're used to, without worrying about the TiVo wanting to change the channel to record something.

Posted by: Polcamilla

quote:
Originally posted by sledgmb
okay, that brings up a couple more questions...

if i use the splitter so that i can watch 1 program while recording another (which would be frequent), does this completely disable the 30-minute buffer pause feature?

If you're watching the 2nd input (cable that isn't routed through the TV) you won't have any of the TiVo features, like pausing live TV. It will be exactly like not having TiVo at all.

quote:
it sure would be nice if they included the tuners in the tivo itself - or made that an option.

Yes, but they don't and they haven't ever indicated they will. TiVo is amazing, but it doesn't solve every TV watching problem ever----I find it curious that most people expect the TiVo to be able to record two things at once (although, usually they think of it as watching one thing while recording another---with the 30 minute buffer on TiVo, it's basically the same thing), given that nobody expects this ability from a VCR. As you say, this would require a second tuner, which adds to the price of an item that most people already see as expensive.

The easiest way to have TiVo record two things at once is to hook two TiVos up to one TV, although I don't think a lot of people do that (again, probably because of the expense). In our house, we only get conflicts 3-4 times a year and we just ask our inlaws to record the things that conflict on their TiVo at their house, then we watch it the next time we're over.

Good luck, and welcome to the TiVolution.

Posted by: Crrink

You will lose use of the trick play features while the TiVo is recording something. You can, however, watch a previously recorded program while TiVo is recording something else, which is pretty nice.
That way you only have to watch live TV if there are 2 shows on that you like at the same time.....I would record the other show with my VCR, but that's just me :)

I really wish they made them with 2 tuners too. For guys like you and me that use cable without the box, that'd be fine, but for people that do use a box, the situation gets complicated pretty quickly.

If you do a search, TiVoPony, a guy who works at TiVo and posts here frequently, started a thread where he explained some of the difficulties. Made sense to me, but I still wish they'd do it :D

Oh, one more thing, *IF* you're really interested in a hard drive based VCR, there is a product or two out there than does this. They're not all that much cheaper than TiVo, and I think you'll find that the TiVo service is REALLY nice to have - it made TV viewing easier than I thought it would, and I researched the heck out of the thing before I bought it.

Hope that sheds a little more light on the questions.

Posted by: Crrink

quote:
Originally posted by Polcamilla
SNIP>
----I find it curious that most people expect the TiVo to be able to record two things at once (although, usually they think of it as watching one thing while recording another---with the 30 minute buffer on TiVo, it's basically the same thing), given that nobody expects this ability from a VCR. As you say, this would require a second tuner, which adds to the price of an item that most people already see as expensive.

SNIP>

Well, the reason that some CRAZY people like me wish they'd make a TiVo that does this are as follows:
-DirecTiVo's do it
-It's technically VERY simple to do.
-The cost would be substantially less than adding a second Tivo
-The support and needing 2 cable boxes issue doesn't occur to most of us until we're told, or spend a lot of time thinking about it.
-VCR's do let you bypass their tuner and watch TV while they are on....I know TiVo does this if you put it in standby mode, but why don't they just have a TV/TiVo button the way VCR's have a TV/VCR button? Then you wouldn't have to worry about buying a splitter and all that stuff.

Oh, and finally, TiVo is a lot more than a VCR - why do you think it's so odd that this is one of the bigger/better/cooler features that TiVo owners expect?

Posted by: Polcamilla

quote:
Originally posted by Crrink
SNIP>

Well, the reason that some CRAZY people like me wish they'd make a TiVo that does this are as follows:

That's not what I meant. If TiVo released a 2 tuner version, I'd just on it in a minute, because I can definitely see the uses.

What I find odd is that the first question out of the mouths of most people when they FIRST find out about TiVo (and know nothing else about what it does) is, "Can it record one thing while I watch another?" Now, what they mean is, "Can it record one thing while I watch another LIVE?", because they're just not used to the idea of time-shifting everything they watch. I've seen a lot of newbies (and potential-bies) get annoyed because TiVo *can't* record two things at once even though they don't expect that capability from their VCRs. I guess what it comes down to is that they know their VCR can record one thing while they watch another and they want the TiVo to work just like that while still allowing them all the trick-play stuff, forgetting that the trick-play stuff is due to TiVo recording all the time.

Posted by: Crrink

I see your point, but I guess I just think that reaction is less surprising than you do.

FWIW I think this is going to get worse as companies like Time Warner make their PVR's more available.

It's gonna be hard for the little single tuner SA TiVo to compete :(

Posted by: FF Steve

1) i just have regular cable tv. no cable box whatsoever. it sounds like i can just use a cable splitter and run one cable to the tivo and one cable to the tv in order to watch one show while recording another. am i correct here? will using this splitter degrade my signal any?

I have the same setup. Works great and a high quality splitter (~$10) will not introduce any noticeable degradation.

2) is it technically possible to buy the tivo and not buy the service? can the tivo be used like a vcr? if so, what is this like? can somebody describe the use of a tivo without the service? if i decide to try out the tivo with monthly service, can i change to lifetime service at some point in the future?

Used without service?...No. Used like a VCR?...only if you have service (meaning that a subscriber can record by time and date rather than off the guide data but a non-subscriber has a boat anchor). Switch from monthly to lifetime?...Yes. Also, you can use the Tivo for several days before you commit to any type of service. You can also can also buy the lifetime subscription and get a refund within 30 days.

3) i've read the stuff about the season pass feature if you subscribe. how reliable is this really? any problems with it?

It is awesome, but depends on the data providers. In general, it is quite reliable.

4) without the directv tivo, is it technically possible at this time to record 2 shows that are currently on at the SAME time? i.e., say you're not home, but there are 2 shows on from 7pm to 9pm and you want to record them both - is this possible? i'm thinking you would have to have 2 tuners inside the tivo and i don't think that's the case with the series2 tivo's. do you as a community expect this to be a feature of an upcoming version of the tivo?

No.

5) funny one here. i have regular cable. when i moved into my house, i called the cable company and they turned me on. i didn't order any premium channels (hbo, showtime, etc). anyway, the owners that lived there before me must have had hbo b/c i've had it ever since i've been in this house. haven't paid the first $0.01 for it. ever. is it possible for them to be alerted to this when/if i get a tivo and turn on my subscription?

No. Reference Tivo's privacy policy.

Posted by: sledgmb

you're exactly right. we (newbies and potential buyers) look into tivo in the first place b/c we want to have no less functionality than our current vcr, and then some. we don't want different...fewer features here, way more features there. we want to be able to do what we've always done, and then have some new features added.

to be honest, it sounds like with a splitter you potentially gain the functionality of the old trusty "TV/VCR" button. if you have one cable going directly into the television - there you have live TV direct from the tv tuner. if you have another cable going into your tivo, with A/V RCA cables hooking up your tivo to your television, you now have buffer-enabled viewing via your "Video 1" channel on your television.

is this right?

Posted by: FF Steve

is this right?

yep :)

cheers,
Steve

Posted by: Crrink

And just to reiterate, you don't have to have a splitter to watch normal, plain old live TV while your TiVo records something else. You have to put it in 'Standby' mode to do this, which requires WAY too many button presses if you ask me, but it will do it.

I like having my signal split because it makes the occasional watching of live TV a lot easier, but that's about it.
I seem to recall that the Sony TiVo's have a button on the remote to put the unit in standby....must be nice :)

Posted by: FF Steve

Good point...I spilt my signal primarily because putting the unit in standby requires too many button pushes.