TiVo Community Forums Archives - Anyone else want to complain to the BBC?

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Anyone else want to complain to the BBC?
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Posted by: panache_blues

Another nonsense story from the BBC. I've sent them a complaint. Anyone else care to join me?

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/entertai...dio/2756497.stm

Posted by: panache_blues

Is this a valid article?

Yes = Valid Article
No = Its nonsense...

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/entertai...dio/2756497.stm

Posted by: sanderton

Could you make it a bit harder to work out which vote meant which, I only had to think about it for 5 minutes! :)

The Discovery channel is where they tape their showcases from isn't it?

Utter nonsense of a story.

Posted by: panache_blues

Yeh sorry about that! Realised the mistake straight away but the forum won't let me edit it. Anyone want to make it read correctly...? he he.

Posted by: Psioneer

No, not really :)

Posted by: iankb

Why have you posted two threads on the same subject? :confused:

Ian

Posted by: ozsat

I have merged the two threads - please try and keep same topic discussions to a single thread.

Posted by: sanderton

I'd already complained before you posted. :)

Posted by: digital_S

It's a bit pointless...

quote:
TiVo users found the machines, which record programmes onto a hard-drive, had stored trailers and commercials from Discovery Channel two nights a week

This only happens on the US TiVo's doesn't it?!!!

Posted by: pgogborn

I am being a bit slow on the uptake here.

I understand the bit about it recording Discovery programmes. I understand the article applies to the USA

Am I right in thinking the article is also stating that the TiVo also always sets your default channel to Discovery. Instead of getting the channel you last viewed / recorded, when you start viewing, for the first time in a day, you will find your TiVo tuned to Discovery?

If it does tune to Discovery over-night, is this new behavior, something that did not use to happen?

Posted by: sanderton

No it's not new behaviour, it;s how TiVo works in the US.

TiVo rents time on Discovery in the small hours to broadcast "showcases" - film trailers, music vids, film trailers etc which are accessed from TiVo Central on a US machine. The TiVos record this only if they are not doing anything else.

Obviously if no user recording is made in the small hours, the TV is still tuned to Discovery in the morning. I'm really trying to see the sinister/invasion of privacy problem there, but I can't!

Posted by: digital_S

quote:
Originally posted by sanderton
I'm really trying to see the sinister/invasion of privacy problem there, but I can't!

Yeah, I can't either! :rolleyes:

Posted by: dlorde

How can it be "distracting attention from Dossa and Joe" when it explicitly brings the subject up again when everyone will have forgotten it?

What is the substance of the proposed complaint to the BBC?

Posted by: pgogborn

quote:
Originally posted by sanderton

TiVo rents time on Discovery in the small hours to broadcast "showcases" - film trailers, music vids, film trailers etc which are accessed from TiVo Central on a US machine. The TiVos record this only if they are not doing anything else.

I now understand.

I hope I was not the only one confused - although I won't be posting a poll to see if anybody except me thought "[the TiVos had also set themselves to Discovery Channel by default the following mornings" was implying that a software switch was setting the TiVo to Discovery, regardless of whether or not it had actually recorded from the Discovery Channel.

Posted by: woody

I wouldn't object to my tivo recording trailers for upcomming shows, provided that it was for more than just a single channel, and only if my tivo wasn't doing anything I had requested.

Posted by: timjon

Hmm... I have the strangest feeling of Deja Vu... :)

Personally, I wouldn't mind showcases too much, although it depends on how it's done. What irritated me about Dossa and Jo (and I know some people didn't mind it) was (a) that it got stuck on the "main menu", which felt intrusive, (b) it couldn't be deleted, and (c) it couldn't be opted out of.

I suspect if (b) and (c) hadn't been the case, there wouldn't have been anything like the number of complaints, but it's easy to say that in hindsight. You can get around (b) with backdoor codes anyway, but of course most users won't have a clue how to do that.

Of course, if the trailers were actually for programs I was interested in, that would be great - kind of a replacement for the long lamented "Inside TiVo" - but of course we all know that in reality, it will be all the second rate stuff that the broadcasters are trying to hype up instead... (cynical, moi?)

Cheers,

Tim.

Posted by: cwaring

quote:
Originally posted by dlorde
What is the substance of the proposed complaint to the BBC?

I think he meant wrt this being a non-story :)

Posted by: Dazbear

I agree - I think a programme showcase would be a fab idea. Half the time I miss the opening episode of things, only hearing about them when people say "did you see last night....."

I do find that since having a TiVo my viewing habits have narrowed to certain genre. I regularly go through the A-Z to set new season passes etc - but I can only really set them for programmes I already know the titles of. I have started watching trailers during commercial breaks etc or at the end of programmes more to try and broaden my viewing.

Anyone else feel that TiVo has narrowed their viewing tastes?

Darren
ps - Dont get me wrong - if anyone tried to ever take my from me TiVo I have trained my pet westie to Kill - Kill boy KILL!

Posted by: mrtickle

The US showcases don't appear on the main menu - they are in a submenu, the equivalent of our "Inside TiVo"/"Channel Highlights".

I'd love the UK service to have something similar. In the US tivo users got the trailer for the Two Towers before anyone else. That is cool.

HTH

Posted by: bignoise

quote:
Originally posted by dlorde
What is the substance of the proposed complaint to the BBC?

That they spend Ł4 a year out of each and every TV licence funding a website which fills itself with badly-researched poorly-thought-out "news" stories with NO BASIS IN FACT, a misleading (and actionable) headline which is not supported by the story, and which was, clearly, written by someone copying an equally poor and unsustainable story out of the Guardian.

I think that's cause for complaint.

Posted by: topbanana

quote:
Originally posted by panache_blues
Is this a valid article?

Yes = Valid Article
No = Its nonsense...

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/entertai...dio/2756497.stm

It valid from the BBCs perspective - they've nearly as little love for PVR technology as commercial broadcasters, taken in this context it's at least as valid as the nonsense that makes it onto the front pages of our newspapers...

Posted by: fister

quote:
Originally posted by mrtickle
In the US tivo users got the trailer for the Two Towers before anyone else.

Before those people who were watching Discovery in the small hours ? ;)

Posted by: ozsat

It must be a real pain though.

Imagine - you go to bed watching ITV1 - and when you wake up - you have to change channel !!

What ever next.

Perhaps TiVo should put in a feature that stops all recording during the hours of darkness.

Posted by: DaveLFC

I quite like the idea of a showcase of up and coming tv series on my tivo, as long as it does not get in the way of my current viewing or recordings.

I'd rather complain about the BBC staying on schedule though!

Posted by: khadland

Hold on a minute folks...

Surely if there's anything to complain to the BBC about it's that they are incapable (especially BBC2!) of either

- running to a published schedule

or

- publishing the schedule they run to

Some tin-pot non-news story about Tivo recording stuff in the middle of the night (isn't that what it's supposed to do???) is just a distraction.

And ozsat - why would you need to change channel in the morning - you aren't admitting to watching Live TV are you???? :D

Posted by: ozsat

Yes - I watch live TV for the news - after all - If I wanted to watch old news - I could watch the repeats on ITV News Channel.

Posted by: Paj

Bizarrely, a google search for:

+invasion +privacy +discovery + Tivo

brings up no related pages whatsoever, except these news articles supposedly reporting the outrage amongst owners in the US.

Where are these complaints? They seem to be from TiVo users who don't understand how the thing works.

Posted by: Paj

Following complaint sent:

Your recent story about TiVo invading the privacy of viewers seems to contain some inaccuracies and unverified facts.

You mention complaints from users in the United States, who found that their TiVo had changed channels to Discovery over night. This is the normal function of TiVo at all times. Whether it be the Discovery Channel or some other station, your TV will rarely be found tuned to the channel on which it was left. TiVo's suggestions are constantly changing channels while you're not there. That's their job.

Oddly, I have been unable to find any complaints of the manner you describe, either on the unofficial (and largest) TiVo bulletin board at www.tivocommunity.com or in a wide-scale Google search. Where is the evidence of these outraged owners?

The only complaints of which I have knowledge are the ones you correctly attribute to the Dossa and Joe episode recorded last year. You will remember these complaints were mostly due to the unsuitable content and the fact that the channel change occurred at prime time.

In summary, it seems that there is little of interest in the story you have published. It fact, if it were a programme on my TiVo I would definitely give it the thumbs down.

Posted by: sanderton

Media Week have printed my letter to them in reply to their "TiVo pulls out of UK" article.

Posted by: panache_blues

They posted my complaint....

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/entertai...dio/2756497.stm

As you can probably tell, it was a slightly ill-composed rant. My advice.. Don't complain when you are giving up smoking... he he.

Darren.

Posted by: larryez

quote:
Originally posted by sanderton
Media Week have printed my letter to them in reply to their "TiVo pulls out of UK" article.

I would be worried that that Tivo don't seem to have written/spoken to them, or any other of these sources of "TiVo pulls out of UK" articles.

Surely the apparent mistruths and potential harm that it is doing to Tivo's future business in the UK is enough to warrant Tivo trying to put a stop to this?

It is great that their UK fan club do their PR for them, but I just hope it doesn't backfire when Tivo's own silence on the subject is found to be because they really are pulling out of the UK.

Posted by: larryez

quote:
Originally posted by sanderton
Media Week have printed my letter to them in reply to their "TiVo pulls out of UK" article.

I wonder if this prompted to write the new article
PVR Market Opens for Sky+

Posted by: cwaring

quote:
Originally posted by panache_blues
They posted my complaint....

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/entertai...dio/2756497.stm

As you can probably tell, it was a slightly ill-composed rant. My advice.. Don't complain when you are giving up smoking... he he.

Darren.

Where? I can't see it.

Posted by: cwaring

quote:
Originally posted by sanderton
Media Week have printed my letter to them in reply to their "TiVo pulls out of UK" article.

Any chance of a link?

Posted by: pgogborn

quote:
Originally posted by topbanana
It valid from the BBCs perspective - they've nearly as little love for PVR technology as commercial broadcasters,

On the other hand, the first I ever heard of the TiVo in the UK was not thanks to Dixons, it was thanks to BBC Director-General's (Greg Dyke) enthusiastic mention of TiVo in his MacTaggart lecture at the start of Guardian Edinburgh international television festival, as reported in the Guardian, Friday August 25, 2000.

Start of extract from lecture:
"But we are only just beginning to see what digital television can really bring. Electronic programme guides are already changing viewing habits in digital homes dramatically, but the real revolution will come with the arrival of the TiVo box and similar in-home, hard disc recording technologies which will give the consumer complete freedom to watch what they want, when they want it."
End of extract from lecture.

I also seem to have a dim recollection of a PR photo in which Greg Dyke was near a TiVo.

If Greg Dykes enthusiasm was (is) a little premature, he was not alone. Conspiracy theories apart, it is worth recalling that Sky's director of new product development Brian Sullivan was reported as "banking on sales of up to 100,000 [TiVo] units in the first 18 months to two years of the product's life."

Posted by: ozsat

quote:
Originally posted by panache_blues
Another nonsense story from the BBC. I've sent them a complaint. Anyone else care to join me?

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/entertai...dio/2756497.stm

This story is timed as being revised on Friday afternoon - but doesn't seem to be any better!

The story is also in the MediaGuardian and appears to carry more facts!

Posted by: sanderton

quote:
Originally posted by cwaring
Any chance of a link?

http://www.mediaweek.co.uk/ThisWeek...x?ContentID=461

Posted by: panache_blues

My comments are in the middle of the original article... I'd have written something more literate if I'd known they would publish it... lol.

Darren.

Posted by: sanderton

It's OK, the "Dr" makes up for it. :)

Posted by: mrtickle

quote:
Originally posted by fister
Before those people who were watching Discovery in the small hours ? ;)

Yes. Before them. Because what is broadcast in the small hours on Discovery is a datastream, not video! When they say it is exclusive to tivo owners, that is the truth! You need a tivo to turn it into video :)

Posted by: mike0151

And now the BBC news site has some nice words about TiVo in an article about PVRs and stuff

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/2762579.stm

Posted by: AlanMWhite

I'm still trying to figure out how Tivo stops 'live TV' it must get terribly confusing for the staff back in the control booths,,everything coming to a standstill every few minutes....or have I got the wrong end of the description!!!!!!!

Posted by: ArwelP

quote:
Originally posted by mike0151
And now the BBC news site has some nice words about TiVo in an article about PVRs and stuff

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/2762579.stm

Oh, my, there's typical BBC accuracy again -- right at the start of the article: "One of the greatest inventions in the modern home was VHS recorder. When it was introduced in 1964 there was a great deal of excitement."...

VHS recorders in 1964? Funny, I seem to remember seeing one of the first ones in about '77 or '78 -- before that we were using U-matics, Philips 1500's and 1700's and old Sony b/w reel-to-reel recorders in my university TV station! You'd expect the BBC at least to get the terminology of video recording right :rolleyes:

Posted by: Ashley

1964? I bet the author wasn't born until the 80s

Posted by: mike0151

I was just fascinated that the BBC site said nice things about Tivo!!! Maybe people there are beginning to miss the beasties or the general lack of availability LOL