TiVo Community Forums Archives - usb control of my cable box?

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usb control of my cable box?
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Posted by: m750

I've got a scientific Atlanta cable box, no serial control... any plans for the future for controling the cable box w/ the built in usb port on the cable box?
AO

Posted by: PrimeRisk

The cable box has a USB port? Wow, that's interesting. What model cable box is it?

Posted by: raitchison

This is why TiVo went with USB in the first place. To give them the ability to do this sort of thing in the future.

Posted by: dgh

The first question that comes to mind is: Is there a documented protocol for changing channels on the USB port?

Posted by: jeffk

The explorer models have a usb port on the cable box. I've never been sure what for exactly. I have a Explorer 3100 and it has a usb port on the front of the box.

Posted by: portersa

I've got an Explorer 2200, and have been wondering the same thing. My dog has a habit of chewing on the IR blaster, and recently ate both of them completely. I never realized how much I recorded on TiVo until I had to manually change channels for things to work.

According to the Scientific Atlanta web site, the USB connection is for future use such as hooking up USB printers, cameras, etc to work with premium services cable companies can offer. Who knows abou that, but let's hope the channel change option works its way in soon.

FYI: the IR blaster that my cable company supplies for the Explorer 2200 to control VCRs (lame attempt to be a PVR), work perfectly for the TiVo to control the cable box. Best part is they are free!

Posted by: smark

Just because it has USB port doesn't mean it will be used. After all the Motorola DCT 5100's have a DOCSIS modem in it that could be used for broadband.

Posted by: FzyLgic

It is certainly possible. USB is just another serial interface after all.

Posted by: m750

yeah, I'm not sure of model...
I also spotted the ir ports on the back, and was thinking something along those lines... but alas, nothing yet. I wonder if they have an open api... Time to send a few emails out. If there is a protocal for inbound communication, I'm all over it.
AO

Posted by: decryption69

portersa - Did the ir blaster that came with your Explorer 2200 (I have the same model) work "faster" than the Tivo ones?

Also, does one work better than both?

Posted by: btwyx

quote:
Originally posted by m750
I've got a scientific Atlanta cable box, no serial control... any plans for the future for controling the cable box w/ the built in usb port on the cable box?

The question no one seems to have asked, is the USB port on your cable box a device or a host port.

USB ports come in 2 varieties, the host ports like on the back of a TiVo, they're long and narrow and have a toung in the middle. Device ports are almost square with 2 corners cut of. Devices can be very simple and dumb, hosts have to have a lot of smarts. You can only connect a device to a host, you can not connect 2 hosts together (they both want to run the show), nor 2 devices (they don't have the smarts to run the other).

If the ports on you cable box are host ports, which I'd guess they were, then you can not connect a TiVo to the cable box with just a USB cable. You could connect them together with a deivce which has 2 device ports, and looks like a different device to both hosts. Both hosts then need to have drivers to run that device, there's not an obvious candidate for such an intermediate device.

If the cable box has a device ports, then the TiVo has to have a driver to support that device, which seems unlikely.

Posted by: headroll

quote:
Originally posted by btwyx
The question no one seems to have asked, is the USB port on your cable box a device or a host port.

USB ports come in 2 varieties, the host ports like on the back of a TiVo, they're long and narrow and have a in the middle. Device ports are almost square with 2 corners cut of. Devices can be very simple and dumb, hosts have to have a lot of smarts. You can only connect a device to a host, you can not connect 2 hosts together (they both want to run the show), nor 2 devices (they don't have the smarts to run the other).

If the ports on you cable box are host ports, which I'd guess they were, then you can not connect a TiVo to the cable box with just a USB cable. You could connect them together with a deivce which has 2 device ports, and looks like a different device to both hosts. Both hosts then need to have drivers to run that device, there's not an obvious candidate for such an intermediate device.

If the cable box has a device ports, then the TiVo has to have a driver to support that device, which seems unlikely.

My cable box (SONY, supplied by Cablevision for IO Digital cable) has both types of USB ports (host and device and labeled that way) I also got firewire, affinity card, memory stick and other things I have no idea what they are (apparently most of them don't do anything right now, but I really haven't tried them all)... when I get home I can send a picture of the back and everyone can give me tests to perform.

Greg

Posted by: JTAnderson

quote:
Originally posted by btwyx
there's not an obvious candidate for such an intermediate device.

How about those cables for connecting two computers via USB? I think they are exactly what you describe.

Posted by: mikedaly

quote:
Originally posted by headroll
My cable box (SONY, supplied by Cablevision for IO Digital cable) has both types of USB ports (host and device and labeled that way) I also got firewire, affinity card, memory stick and other things I have no idea what they are (apparently most of them don't do anything right now, but I really haven't tried them all)... when I get home I can send a picture of the back and everyone can give me tests to perform.

Wow - really interesting.

I think the likelihood that ANY control of this cable box other than IR will work right now is virtually nil. And if there isn't a standard for USB cable-box control, then its pretty likely that TiVo will never operate the box in that way. Interesting, though.

Posted by: btwyx

quote:
Originally posted by JTAnderson
How about those cables for connecting two computers via USB? I think they are exactly what you describe.

They are, but there's no classs standard for them, and I doubt TiVo has a driver for them.

Posted by: m750

it has host ports...
I have attempted to contact the company, because on their website, it lists uses as attaching to a printer, digital camera, etc, and it got me thinking of a usb ethernet adapter... oh let me count the ways... We'll see if they ever get back to me w/ the details of the device.
AO

Posted by: jodell

There is a specificaton for the USB port available from Scientific Atlanta, but only to selected (read lots of $) development partners. There is no API that is publicly available for using the USB port for anything useful to TiVo (like channel changing).

The USB port can be made to work, but a driver must be loaded in the STB as well as in the PVR. Getting a driver loaded in the STB requires either Scientific Atlanta or the Cable Compay's assistance.

While I hope TiVo can pull that off, I will not hold my breath. I worked for Keen Personal Media and know first hand how much work it was....

Jeff

Posted by: portersa

The IR blaster from the Explorer 2200 doesn't seem to be any more reliable than the origional TiVo ones. I only have one blaster now, so that's all I'm using. I haven't missed any channel changes, but it doesn't seem to work any better either. It's a good backup plan just in case something happens (read puppy gets excited) to the TiVo ones;)

Posted by: m750

Thanks Jodell...
It's a shame more companys aren't like Tivo and Audiotron, that foster the sub culture to hack (in the proper sence of the word) their devices, and provide additional user driven features... Think of how many people would be happier w/ thier cable if it were a little more integrated w/ thier pvr. Honestly, the ir blaster, and it's associated clugyness is a level of complexity that most want to avoid, and if you could tell someone, oh, don't worry about the cable box, you just hook it up, I think people would be less interested in a SAT solution. I for one, wish I had gone the dual tuner, totally integrated SAT route, it's just less fuss, much less muss.