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CARNIVAL - 10/26..... untagged spoilers
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Posted by: Family

I think the show has picked up. Forget for a moment the arc.... last nite's tale of Justin was interesting and explained a little more about both him and the sister. I also thought last week's carnvial justice story was equally interesting.

My feeling...... as long as the show gives us an interesting story weekly and not random scenes that never get explained like a woman puking money or Ben waking up in a cave.... I'm in.

Posted by: firerose818

I really enjoyed last night's episode. Was it a little shorter than the other ones have been? My clock said 9:51 when it ended.

Anyway, I enjoyed learning a little more about Justin and his sister. I want to know why there were people chasing them after the train wreck though. Are they supposed to be the Romanoffs? (That is the only thing my husband and I could come up with after watching this, although I think that Justin and Iris would be a little old for this scenario)

And why was Lodz beating Lila with his cane at the end?

I'm looking forward to next week!

-Rose

Posted by: Fleegle

quote:
Originally posted by firerose818

And why was Lodz beating Lila with his cane at the end?

I'm looking forward to next week!

-Rose

I think he's going to tell Ben that someone beat Lila and try to get him to heal her while he "watches". Interesting that Lodz was trying to show Ben that he can heal when he already knew it. Has Lodz been giving Ben his visions lately?

Posted by: tonyoci

I think they were chasing the russian kids (justin etc.) because they knew about Justin's evil powers. That was my theory at least.

I thought it was a good show also, everything made sense for a change at least until Lodz went nuts on Lila. That info from the website that Lodz used to have Samson's job seems key information but anyone watching the show would not know it, so ultimately it's probably not key.

It's clear that Justin seems to have the power to cause harm and Ben to cause it. Many people were thinking that Justin was bad and Ben good, and this was a switcheroo, but perhaps Justin really is good and Ben really is bad, who knows.

T

Posted by: Big_Daddy

I guess I'm in the minority - I thought this episode was slower and less interesting than most of its predecessors. However, I did very much enjoy the further development of secondary characters like Justin's sister and the snake handler (I forget her name). I also enjoyed the bit of backstory on Justin.

Lodz's attack on Lila struck me differently. I thought he attacked her out of rage - he expected / wanted to be the one to teach, guide, and possibly control Ben. When he heard Ben was doing it on his own, and he's cut out of the cycle, he got angry and took it out on her.

One thing that struck me about the Carnival is maybe it's like Purgatory - you're stuck in it and can't get out. At least, Stumpy can't leave.

Posted by: helmsman

Hmmm... First post on the board... lets make it a good one! :)

The website for Carnivale has made it quite clear that this is an "epic struggle between light and dark"... good and evil. But it's pretty obvious that this show isn't a canvas of black and white, but of the many shades of gray that make up real life.

To me, from what I've gathered so far, both Ben and Brother Justin obviously have powers... but their powers run in slightly different directions. Bens power can heal (even bring back the dead, as evidenced by his kitten in the first episode), but at a terrible price to all those within his "blast radius". Brother Justin's power seems to be more narrowly focussed... but we have yet to see it be used for anything but destruction.

So what we have here, is someone with the power to do good (at a high cost to everything else in the vicinity), and someone with a narrowly focussed power to do harm. Both powers could be used for good, but brother Justin's powers as demonstrated to date would be far harder to use for good...and all to easy to use for chaos, as evidenced so far.

I don't think that Ben is "intending" to fight for the light, or Brother Justin is "intending" to fight for the dark... but that doesn't mean that they don't influence the battle with their gifts.

As far as Lodz goes, I think that he's the wildcard... the serpent in the garden, if you will. He's probably closer to the dark than anyone else featured in the show. His beating of Lila (the bearded lady) to me was his rage at having his plans for Ben undercut by Ben not listening to him and going on about learing how to use his powers... listen to what Lila was saying just before the rage hit, and you get the idea. Lodz has plans for Ben, plans that do not sound too kindly... and a kind man doesn't beat people when they hear news that they don't like.

To me, the greater mystery is "Management"... Contrary to Jonsey's believe, I think that there is such a creature, otherwise Lodz would still be in charge and Samsom wouldn't be running the show. Both have talked to Management, and Management is obviously steering the show as necessary to help Ben figure out what's going on. Management has a larger stake in the matter than what has been revealed so far, I think...

Posted by: tonyoci

helmsman, I like your analysis though I would disagree on Brother Justin's use of his power. He has used it only for harm but he has only harmed "bad" people (at least as far as I can remember), the town council man, the man who was chasing him and his sister etc.

I agree about Lodz.

Management to me is not well developed yet, we really know nothing about it and while directing events it has not really affected the story directly yet.

I'm too dumb to figure this all out.

T

Posted by: mp2526

quote:
Originally posted by Family
as long as the show gives us an interesting story weekly and not random scenes that never get explained like a woman puking money

What needs to be explained about the woman puking money? Brother Justin's powers manifested themselves into the woman puking money because she stole from the collection plate during the sermon. It was just a scene to show us his powers early on.

Posted by: helmsman

quote:
Originally posted by tonyoci
helmsman, I like your analysis though I would disagree on Brother Justin's use of his power. He has used it only for harm but he has only harmed "bad" people (at least as far as I can remember), the town council man, the man who was chasing him and his sister etc.

That's my point exactly, though... yes, it's "bad" people that he's hurt, but the people targeted were all "crossing" Brother Justin... he didn't go out and spin the head of a murderer at random, he nailed someone that was just trying to get help and was left with _no other options_ by his sister. The councilman that was opposing him was an adversary... but I doubt that he was breaking any laws of the time. I really doubt that Brother Justin even _intended_ to do harm in the first place. I think that part of the issues facing Brother Justin is that he _knows_ that people around him get hurt when he gets mad, and this is why he's been such a strict man of God...

Imagine walking around with a weapon, that you _cannot_ get rid of, which fires itself when you get into certain moods, and it tends to really fry whoever it touches. Wouldn't you be a bit circumspect and worried about it? I know _I_ would...

And, on the other side of the coin, how about a power that when used, helps one person, and nukes anything else within a short (or not so short) radius? At least Ben seems to be able to actually control the deployment of his powers, whereas Brother Justin seems to be along for the ride with his.

And, when you get down to it, what's the real difference between good and evil, if it's not control over ones actions?

The fun thing about this show, in my opinion, is that it obviously has a LOT of interesting surprises in store for us as it goes on, though... when the show started, Brother Justin was an annoyace character to me, but he's developing into something rather interesting to watch, just to see where it's going.

I've heard it said that if you want to know the true measure of a person, look at how they deal with adversity. So far, those opposing Brother Justin seem to have a short life expectancy, and Lodz strikes out, well, blindly (pardon the pun). I think that this is going to be an excellent foreshadow into what will develop with these characters later on.

Posted by: helmsman

quote:
Originally posted by mp2526
What needs to be explained about the woman puking money? Brother Justin's powers manifested themselves into the woman puking money because she stole from the collection plate during the sermon. It was just a scene to show us his powers early on.

You are probably right about what that was... I personally figured it to be another "vision from God" for him, especially since nothing was left behind afterwards.

Posted by: nineatesix

I think the radio host has a more personal interest in Brother Justin and furthering his work than has yet been revealed.

Posted by: KRS

quote:
Originally posted by helmsman
That's my point exactly, though... yes, it's "bad" people that he's hurt, but the people targeted were all "crossing" Brother Justin... he didn't go out and spin the head of a murderer at random, he nailed someone that was just trying to get help and was left with _no other options_ by his sister.

OK, so just to clarify (for my own edification) - Brother Justin's vision on the bridge was of his murder of his father....right? He (as the child) spun his father's head?

Perhaps this was obvious, but it wasn't until seeing the photo at the end that I fully understood that what we thought was Justin on the riverbank was actually his own father. He asked of the children's mother to find out that she was dead (killed in the accident). Then for some reason, he asked of their father, only to be told that their father was an evil man. Assuming all of the above is accurate, why was the father an evil man? He didn't seem to have any useful powers on the riverbank....so it must have been something more "mortal." Hmmmm....

Welcome helmsman. Good discussion to turn up in!

Posted by: helmsman

quote:
Originally posted by nineatesix
I think the radio host has a more personal interest in Brother Justin and furthering his work than has yet been revealed.

It seemed to me that the radio host had an almost creepy attraction to Brother Justin's sister, actually... and of course, since when doesn't a newsie want something that people will tune in to listen more about? :)

One thought to keep in the back of your mind... the website description for the sister (sorry, the name escapes me right now) indicated that she would do _anything_ for the sake of her brother (or words to that effect). Anything is a very, very broad range of things, and I found it interesting that they put that in the description... a foreshadowing?

Posted by: helmsman

quote:
Originally posted by KRS
OK, so just to clarify (for my own edification) - Brother Justin's vision on the bridge was of his murder of his father....right? He (as the child) spun his father's head?

Eehhh, heck if I know. It _might_ be the father, but too much of the dialog wouldn't seem to support it. Then again, this show _loves_ to go around in circles, doesn't it? :)

The impression that I had, was that the "stranger in the forest" was just that, and that Brother Justin was identifying with him, because of his guilt over his taking of that life... the entire sequence showing "him" in there appears to have been a flashback on Brother Justin's part (although, to be honest, I really need to see that episode again... I missed some parts, because I got interrupted, and I didn't actually get my TiVo until tonight!).

The family portrait could indicate that it was the father that was the victim... but in that case, it would seem strange that, if the father was _that_ evil of a guy, that the children would dedicate their lives to the same profession as their "evil father".

On the other side of the coin, if it were the father, and the kids were operating under some sort of hysterical delusion, then they might feel sufficiently guilty about taking their fathers life that they then would feel compelled to "pick up where he left off". That might easily lead to the sheer force of dedication that the siblings seem to have (coupled with guilt over having the ability to flick off someone's life like a lightswitch, with about as much apparent effort).

As far as the "assassins" seeking the two children... that points to delusion to me, as lets face it, there isn't a lot of call to go after train wreck survivors with the purpose of murder. Perhaps it was an early manifestation of Brother Justins power... the dementia was caused by him? Perhaps even expanding to the father, who "didn't remember who he was" and treated his children as strangers.... just conjecture on my part, thought. Having your entire world crash around you would be traumatic enough... perhaps he just pushed them all over the edge a bit more, and didn't snap out of it until the death that he caused.

Even when this show is over, I'm betting that a lot is going to be left open to interpretation, though... I'm beginning to think that the writers have been dipping in Lodz's Absinthe! :)

Posted by: Rob Helmerichs

I'm not ENTIRELY sure that Justin even has powers, rather than some (presumably dark) force looking out for him...

Posted by: markp99

What was Justin's sister holding from the suitcase under the bed. Looked like a riding whip.

Any ideas...seemed a bit kinky to me.... :)

Posted by: Redleg

quote:
Originally posted by markp99
What was Justin's sister holding from the suitcase under the bed. Looked like a riding whip.

Any ideas...seemed a bit kinky to me.... :)

It's the whip Justin used to flagellate himself as part of his "devotions."

Posted by: mp2526

quote:
Originally posted by markp99
What was Justin's sister holding from the suitcase under the bed. Looked like a riding whip.

Any ideas...seemed a bit kinky to me.... :)

That was the whip that in an earlier episode, Justin was punishing himself with after using his powers.

Posted by: Family

Man you guys are good. I missed so much.

Thanks mp2526...... I never put the woman vomiting the coins as being Justin's powers. I must be losing it.

Posted by: drew2k

Something else to qustion: exactly how powerful is Justin's sister? She told the radio reporter that her life is about faith and action, but up to this point on the show she has not demonstrated any action whatsoever. I'm sure it was because of the wine, but she spoke more in this one episode than all previous episodes combined, and maybe we'll start to see more about her.

I also think this episode is the turning point in the series. At the end of the show, Iris was pleased to hear her bother Alexei (Justin) on the phone and she was definitely not shocked at his statement that she always knew he had it in him, what he could do. She actually looked disappointed or sad, as if she was aware Justin was finally acknowledging it, and without her there to "protect" him, he might succumb to his abilities.

It's also now ackowledged to the viewer that Lodz and Lila have known about Ben's powers all along, just not to the extent of his powers. Previously they only hinted at it, and now we have a hint at Lodz motivation for "teaching" Ben.

The show is definitely getting juicier ...

Posted by: Big_Daddy

quote:
Originally posted by drew2k

I also think this episode is the turning point in the series. At the end of the show, Iris was pleased to hear her bother Alexei (Justin) on the phone and she was definitely not shocked at his statement that she always knew he had it in him, what he could do. She actually looked disappointed or sad, as if she was aware Justin was finally acknowledging it, and without her there to "protect" him, he might succumb to his abilities.

That's a good thought. Her expression was ambiguous to me, but at least there was some sign of being distressed or disappointed. Perhaps there'll be more of a parallel between her and Lodz - both are trying to guide / teach / (control?) Justin and Ben respectively.

It would be interesting if Ben is "good" while Justin is "evil", but others are trying to mold them into something else: Lodz being "evil" and Iris being "good". Quotes are intentional, good and evil are looking increasingly relative.

Posted by: jbondsr

quote:
Originally posted by helmsman
Eehhh, heck if I know. It _might_ be the father, but too much of the dialog wouldn't seem to support it. Then again, this show _loves_ to go around in circles, doesn't it? :)

The family portrait could indicate that it was the father that was the victim... but in that case, it would seem strange that, if the father was _that_ evil of a guy, that the children would dedicate their lives to the same profession as their "evil father".

If your talking about the picture at the end it look like a picture of the Reverened that was Justin's mentor (the man had a collar on)the one who told him to go back to hi old church. I think he took them in when they where children.

Posted by: pcgrrll

I sure am glad I have you guys around here to keep me straight on what's going on in this show, and glad to know that I'm not the only one who sometimes feel that they have no clue to what's going on. Although, I do have to say that I picked up on the fact that Iris and Justin were the two kids before the show was over..yay me :D

Other than that..I come here to have the show explained to me. It's okay though, because I think the show is awesome and I really enjoy watching it. Maybe I should say most of the time, last week's ending was a bit disturbing and I didn't feel quite right the rest of the day.

Posted by: dswallow

quote:
Originally posted by pcgrrll
I sure am glad I have you guys around here to keep me straight on what's going on in this show, and glad to know that I'm not the only one who sometimes feel that they have no clue to what's going on. Although, I do have to say that I picked up on the fact that Iris and Justin were the two kids before the show was over..yay me :D

Other than that..I come here to have the show explained to me. It's okay though, because I think the show is awesome and I really enjoy watching it. Maybe I should say most of the time, last week's ending was a bit disturbing and I didn't feel quite right the rest of the day.

If you really wanna see all the interpretations and theories, you need to watch what happens at www.televisionwithoutpity.com forums right after each episode airs... threads just grow exponentially with posts right in front of your eyes.

Posted by: drew2k

quote:
Originally posted by dswallow
If you really wanna see all the interpretations and theories, you need to watch what happens at www.televisionwithoutpity.com forums right after each episode airs... threads just grow exponentially with posts right in front of your eyes.

I just checked it out, and here's the synopsis from the prior episode of Carnivale:

quote:
New Kid In Town
Carnivale - Her fate was definitely twisted. She was but Management's pawn. She got a lot of horny zombie miners she calls johns. How they mourn in the big top, hot dusty sweat. Pa Pimp wants a funeral, Ma wants Russian Roulette. So Samson called up the barkeep: "Please bring me whiskey." He said, "Aye, we've not been but spirits here since 1923." And still more rousties are coming from far away. Count them up in the middle of night, just to hear them say, "Welcome to the Hotel Babylonia. What an ugly place, what a carved-up face."

Pretty smart summary! Thanks for pointing out that site! :)

Posted by: geektron

I was wondering if the people looking for the children were actually assassins or just looking to rescue them and the children were delusional.

I thought that the sister was flirting with the reporter and I am still not sure what his exact intentions are.

The show is definitely getting more interesting. And reading these threads makes it that much more enjoyable.

Posted by: pcgrrll

quote:
If you really wanna see all the interpretations and theories, you need to watch what happens at www.televisionwithoutpity.com forums right after each episode airs... threads just grow exponentially with posts right in front of your eyes.

Boy, I have a hard enough time getting my a@# out from in front of the computer or television as it is...but I will definitely have to check it out.

Now if only I could figure out how to live on 3 hours of sleep a night. That would be sweet :D

Posted by: geektron

quote:
Originally posted by pcgrrll
Boy, I have a hard enough time getting my a@# out from in front of the computer or television as it is...but I will definitely have to check it out.

Now if only I could figure out how to live on 3 hours of sleep a night. That would be sweet :D

I think we all struggle with that. To contribute to my problem, I now have my DVR in my office with the computer. I'm doing some serious mutli-tasking. ;)

Posted by: pcgrrll

quote:
I think we all struggle with that. To contribute to my problem, I now have my DVR in my office with the computer. I'm doing some serious mutli-tasking.

I wish I did ... I just have a regular old tvwith commercials..YIKES :(

Posted by: uncdrew

So Ben obviously really hates to use his power.

But he uses it to heal a broken finger? Uh...

So he feels guilty for breaking it, or is falling for the mom. But to use his power (which he hates to do) and to use it on a carny who will probably will blab it to others? I mean the guy with the broken finger is the strong-man, not the smart-man.

I dunno...

Posted by: dswallow

quote:
Originally posted by uncdrew
So Ben obviously really hates to use his power.

But he uses it to heal a broken finger? Uh...

So he feels guilty for breaking it, or is falling for the mom. But to use his power (which he hates to do) and to use it on a carny who will probably will blab it to others? I mean the guy with the broken finger is the strong-man, not the smart-man.

I dunno...

Broken finger? The strong-man's ARM was broken, and you got to see that in all it's "glory" too. VERY broken arm.

Ben's used his healing power on humans compassionately once, wanted to use it compassionately two more times, and now has used it to correct a wrong he was responsible for.

Posted by: uncdrew

Hmm... How I missed the arm thing is beyond me. But I'll believe you. To me it looked pretty minor, hence my thought of the healing being out of character.

Posted by: mp2526

If you notice, after Ben heals Gabriel, he tells him to take the splint off his arm.

Posted by: TBDigital

Yeah, and that wasn't his finger bent backwards or anything, that was a bone sticking through his arm...

Posted by: uncdrew

Ah, that explains it.

I saw that and thought it was a dislocated finger. Seeing the episode right after a football game (where it happened) will do that.

Arm sling -- well, I've seen those worn by people with hangnails. And back when this took place, they wrapped slings around peoples' heads who had toothaches, so I didn't place much merit in that.

Posted by: Big_Daddy

quote:
Originally posted by dswallow

Ben's used his healing power on humans compassionately once, wanted to use it compassionately two more times, and now has used it to correct a wrong he was responsible for.

But he DIDN'T use it to heal Dora after she was killed by the miners! And we've seen through flashbacks that he can bring the dead back to life (I think he resurrected a cat, which his mother subsequently drowned because she felt it was a crime against God). I wonder if, once the carnival knows more about his powers, this decision will come back to haunt him.

Posted by: Rob Helmerichs

Well, the cat didn't exactly "come back right," did it?

I think there's a difference between resurrecting the dead and makling zombies.

Posted by: Big_Daddy

quote:
Originally posted by Medieval Guy
Well, the cat didn't exactly "come back right," did it?

Really? I thought the cat was okay - it sure drowned okay! I'll have to go back and catch that episode on the marathon.

Posted by: macdannyk1

I assumed Ben's powers couldn't bring the dead back to life, just heal what ailed them (at least with humans). But then, assuming anything with this show is kinda silly...

Posted by: mp2526

quote:
Originally posted by uncdrew

Arm sling -- well, I've seen those worn by people with hangnails. And back when this took place, they wrapped slings around peoples' heads who had toothaches, so I didn't place much merit in that.

I agree that an arm sling doesn't mean he had a broken arm, what I said was that Ben asked him to take the splint (two pieces of wood strapped to his arm) off his arm, which for the most part, indicates a break.

Posted by: helmsman

quote:
Originally posted by Big_Daddy
But he DIDN'T use it to heal Dora after she was killed by the miners! And we've seen through flashbacks that he can bring the dead back to life (I think he resurrected a cat, which his mother subsequently drowned because she felt it was a crime against God). I wonder if, once the carnival knows more about his powers, this decision will come back to haunt him.

The indications seem to me that the more damage he's trying to undo, the bigger the blast radius displayed by his power. We didn't get to see what the damage was from bringing back the cat, but when he healed the lame little girl, it looked like an entire field was nuked by this power... the brown, shriveled up plantlife seemed to go on forever.

Perhaps Ben was worried that trying to bring back a person to life (especially one mutilated and broken up like that, we are talking about a LOT of work there) might create a blast radius that would be larger than he would be willing to work with... what if he killed a number of the carnies (remember, the gravesite was only 200 yards from the camp) in the process of bringing one back? Even IF he could bring her back... her sprit was obviously elesewhere, in the thrall of whatever is holding the rest of the town back...

Then, lets look at the whole "how people react" thing... assuming that he could bring back the dead, how would the carnies react to him? Would they treat him like his mother did? And how would they react to the resurrected dead girl?

On the whole, the safe path for everyone was to let that one go, and for Ben to "stick to what he knows"... if he's going to bring back the dead, let it be for something _really_ worthwhile later on, not this early in the game.

As far as why Ben cured Gabriel, that's pretty easy... yeah, he's likely to slip up and reveal his secret, but he was responsible for what happened there, and lets face it... Gabriel is a big six year old, and who wants something like that on their conscience? "He Broke it, He fixed it". It was the honorable thing to do.

Posted by: Big_Daddy

quote:
Originally posted by helmsman
The indications seem to me that the more damage he's trying to undo, the bigger the blast radius displayed by his power. We didn't get to see what the damage was from bringing back the cat, but when he healed the lame little girl, it looked like an entire field was nuked by this power... the brown, shriveled up plantlife seemed to go on forever.

I agree with everything you said. Most people who understood the pay-as-you-go approach to Ben's healing power may get why he didn't bring Dora back. However, Stumpy may be different.

And I think we might have seen the blast radius (I love that term here!) when he brought back the cat. Remember how desolate the landscape was around the home where his mom died? How it looked like a deserted desert wasteland? Don't you wonder how it got that way?

Posted by: mp2526

quote:
Originally posted by Big_Daddy
Remember how desolate the landscape was around the home where his mom died? How it looked like a deserted desert wasteland? Don't you wonder how it got that way?

So maybe Ben is responsible for the dust bowl days in Oklahoma. While he was young and inexperienced with his powers. :)

Posted by: Rob Helmerichs

I wonder if the fish are edible?

If so--great way to go fishing! And a great way to kill two birds with one stone, at a time when food is hard to come by.

Posted by: uncdrew

Hmm...

Since I wasn't paying enough attention on that arm issue, perhaps I shouldn't chime in on this one.

But...

Wasn't it dry in Ben's hometown because of the great dust bowl thing. The okies, grapes of wrath, that kinda stuff?

Posted by: mp2526

quote:
Originally posted by uncdrew

Wasn't it dry in Ben's hometown because of the great dust bowl thing. The okies, grapes of wrath, that kinda stuff?

But like I said, who's to say he didn't go wild bringing dead animals back to life as a kid and started the whole dust bowl :)

Posted by: uncdrew

Ok, I'll go away now. I'm not paying much attention to anything.

Posted by: drew2k

I can think of two other points for why Ben may not have tried to revive Dora ... (1) he was trapped in the tunnel with Scutter and bears and miners, oh my, until almost daybreak, and was pretty much out of it when he finally emerged. Maybe there's a time limit after death that Ben knows and we don't; and (2) Dora was most likely never alone after Jonesy found her body. She was either with family or being prepped for burial, so unless Ben was willing to announce his powers to the whole Carnivale, he probably couldn't sneak in and touch her.

Posted by: helmsman

quote:
Originally posted by mp2526
So maybe Ben is responsible for the dust bowl days in Oklahoma. While he was young and inexperienced with his powers. :)

Creating the Dust Bowl by bringing back your cat? Wow, talk about a guilt trip... :)

Seriously, though, since people weren't dropping dead all over the place during the dust bowl, I don't think that they could logically pin that one on Ben...

Posted by: helmsman

quote:
Originally posted by Big_Daddy

And I think we might have seen the blast radius (I love that term here!) when he brought back the cat. Remember how desolate the landscape was around the home where his mom died? How it looked like a deserted desert wasteland? Don't you wonder how it got that way?

Personally, I just figured that it was the dust bowl in action... especially given the fact that there was a good amount of time between the kitten episode and when Ben's mother died. However, it wouldn't surprise me to find out that the situation was made _worse_ by Ben occasionally flexing his muscles, so to speak...

Posted by: helmsman

quote:
Originally posted by Medieval Guy
I wonder if the fish are edible?

If so--great way to go fishing! And a great way to kill two birds with one stone, at a time when food is hard to come by.

Personally, I would be a bit leery of it (or have someone else try it first). The life has been sucked right out of those fish.. think about the shriveled up plantlife that he left behind him. I'm kind of betting that it wouldn't make very good food.

Of course, if you are hungry enough, any port in a storm, eh? :)

Posted by: helmsman

quote:
Originally posted by drew2k
I can think of two other points for why Ben may not have tried to revive Dora ... (1) he was trapped in the tunnel with Scutter and bears and miners, oh my, until almost daybreak, and was pretty much out of it when he finally emerged. Maybe there's a time limit after death that Ben knows and we don't; and (2) Dora was most likely never alone after Jonesy found her body. She was either with family or being prepped for burial, so unless Ben was willing to announce his powers to the whole Carnivale, he probably couldn't sneak in and touch her.

#2 Reason looks _very_ plausable to me... even if he were to announce his ability, though, who would seriosly believe him, other than Lodz, who seems to have an interest in controlling him anyway? And, were he to simply "take matters into his own hands", he would then be zorching a good number of carnies in the process.

What's up with that blasted Bear, anyway? Circus Bears in WWI trenches?
Someone's been hitting the Absinthe again...

Posted by: uncdrew

#3 reason -- he didn't really seem to approve of the coochie dancers...

Posted by: mostman

quote:
Originally posted by uncdrew
#3 reason -- he didn't really seem to approve of the coochie dancers...

Naah - I think Ben likes a good "blow off" just as much as the next guy.

-Mike

Posted by: helmsman

quote:
Originally posted by uncdrew
#3 reason -- he didn't really seem to approve of the coochie dancers...

It's obvious that Ben has a lot of emotional baggage from his "strict religious upbringing"... but he's slowly overcoming such preconceptions to see what lies under the surface.

Posted by: Weezoh

quote:
Originally posted by Medieval Guy
I wonder if the fish are edible?

If so--great way to go fishing! And a great way to kill two birds with one stone, at a time when food is hard to come by.

When I saw them walking into the water i said that, hey great way to get dinner for the troops.

I was surprised that they didn't take a few strings of fish back to at least explain where they've been. Not like they're usually rolling in money and fresh food.

prolly didn't want to clean all them fish though.

Posted by: LlamaLarry

Maybe when he sucks the life out of things to repair something he does more than kill it, maybe he renders it devoid of all life/nutrients.

Posted by: lordargent

What we have here is a classic case of defiling regeneration. It's a 10th level necromancer spell.

/ too much D&D

Actually, I remember seeing something like this on a cartoon when I was a kid (I think he-man). There was some kind of wizard, that, in order to cast spells, had to drain the life energy of something via touch. Trees would shrivel, etc etc.

Posted by: dmaneyapanda

yeah, dark sun.