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TIVO forcing me to repeat guided setup!!!???
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Posted by: N2qew

I recently received a message telling me that I have to repeat guided setup, as "the lineup I have will be deleted 12/8". They mention that the Dish Network linup I have is temporary - yeah right, for the past 2 1/2 years. Seems to me that once I repeat the guided setup, I'll be losing all my scheduled programs. I tried to call "customer service", but as others mention in here, that's a hopeless proposition. I was told that I'd wait for 20-25 minutes, but I hung up after my cordless phone died at the 1 1/2 hour mark. This is the second time I've been through this where they've blamed Dish, but my Dish subscription hasn't changed significantly. What gives? It seems that they should be able to push things around without me blowing my setup.

Posted by: ccwf

Are you using the “no locals” DISH lineup? TiVo has been warning that they are going to delete that for some time now to give everyone plenty of notice.

As for losing your season passes, season passes are tied to the station call letters. So, even if you switched from DISH to cable, you wouldn't necessarily invalidate your season passes.

Posted by: dgh

I thought the national line up had gone away a year ago but maybe not.

See this thread from 10/2002. I did the switch back then and didn't have any problem at all.

Posted by: TiVo_Al

I think the question we have is why we have to do this AGAIN.

Less than two months ago I was told by TiVo to do a new setup because my Dish lineup was going away.

Not two days later I started getting "A Lineup Change Has Occurred" messages almost daily.

Now TiVo wants me to do another new setup.

If we did the setup recently, do we have to do it again or not?

Posted by: N2qew

The question IS both why do we have to do this AGAIN and why do we have to do this at all? It seems that they can push channels around at will. A prime example is the "lineup changes" that keep occurring to channel 3 on the cable. (I have broadcast basic cable, and dish) There is NOTHING on channel 3. This is due to the fact that there is a channel 3 station in town, and, because the cable system leaks like a sieve, anything that they would put there would be massively interfered with - and no, they can't put ch 3 on ch 3. Anyway, I've tried in the past, as well as recently to talk to them on the phone, and as we all know, it's nearly impossible to get through to "customer service".

Posted by: TiVoBill

If you received that message, it indicates that you chose a lineup called "Dish Network no locals (Temporary) - USA, Sat " when you last ran Guided Setup. We will be deleting that lineup on December 8th (after a series of messages letting customers using that lineup know of the impending change). If you do not complete Guided Setup and choose a different lineup before that date, you will no longer receive updated Program Guide Information.

A bit of background: The "Dish Network no locals (Temporary) - USA, Sat" lineup was created a couple of years ago when Dish first starting moving local channels to lower numbers, causing there to be too many channels in the national DISH lineup for Series1 DVRs to handle. The "temporary" lineup was set up to address that issue. It is no longer necessary and is no longer going to be available as of December 8th.

If you received a message telling you that your using the temporary lineup, please repeat Guided Setup and choose a DISH Network lineup that has the name of the city closest to you (i.e. Dish Network - San Francisco, CA) or the national lineup (Dish Network - USA, National) if you don't receive local channels from DISH. Make sure that you do not choose the one with "Temporary" in the title.

Posted by: pv

Note also that repeating guided setup is no big deal, and you will not lose your recordings or season passes. It's nothing to go red-faced about. PV

Posted by: N2qew

quote:
Originally posted by pv
Note also that repeating guided setup is no big deal, and you will not lose your recordings or season passes. It's nothing to go red-faced about. PV

Other than the fact that I got to wait 50 minutes for what started out out as 4 minutes on the screen after the first call, and after re-selecting what channels I actually receive, it sat there and churned for 7 hours. So much for the 20-40 minutes it says on the screen. Then, of course, there's the issue that I had to go to outside sources - this forum - for information that I should have gotten from the customer-no-service department of the company I pay every month. Then, there's the issue that I've had to do this before, and I've changed NOTHING on my end.

Posted by: TiVo_Al

I did rerun Guided Setup on one of my two TiVos last night.

What I found that while I was using the temporary Dish USA linup in the past, the Guided Setup TiVo forced me to do a couple of months ago changed that to the National USA linup.

Since I was not using the temporary lineup at the time I got the message from TiVo to run Guided Setup again, why did I get this message at all?

And I agree with N2qew that it's alot more than a 20-30 minute operation. I had to go through the entire Dish lineup to reselect the channels I receive, along with the phone calls and indexing time. If this was not necessary, I sure wasted a bunch of time.

Posted by: N2qew

quote:
Originally posted by TiVoBill
If you received that message, it indicates that you chose a lineup called "Dish Network no locals (Temporary) - USA, Sat " when you last ran Guided Setup. We will be deleting that lineup on December 8th (after a series of messages letting customers using that lineup know of the impending change). If you do not complete Guided Setup and choose a different lineup before that date, you will no longer receive updated Program Guide Information.

A bit of background: The "Dish Network no locals (Temporary) - USA, Sat" lineup was created a couple of years ago when Dish first starting moving local channels to lower numbers, causing there to be too many channels in the national DISH lineup for Series1 DVRs to handle. The "temporary" lineup was set up to address that issue. It is no longer necessary and is no longer going to be available as of December 8th.

If you received a message telling you that your using the temporary lineup, please repeat Guided Setup and choose a DISH Network lineup that has the name of the city closest to you (i.e. Dish Network - San Francisco, CA) or the national lineup (Dish Network - USA, National) if you don't receive local channels from DISH. Make sure that you do not choose the one with "Temporary" in the title.

Now I'm back to receiving to endless messages of "A lineup change has occurred"....

Between that and the fact that the Dish package choices that are listed DO NO REFLECT REALITY!, I'm more than a little P.O'd at Tivo (the company) right now. It seems that with a little work on their part, they could make the periodic "time to re-run setup, again" a little easier. Dish has several base packages to which you add things like HBO, MAX, Locals etc. The "only takes 20-40 minutes" turns into several hours of direct effort, times the number of customers that you make do this. From sitting down and writing down all the received channels on dish, to manually deleting them, only to have you arbitrarily add 682 ETDRAMA, 683 ETGLOBE, 684 ETNEWS, and 685 ETCHINA.

If I do a channel up past one of those channels that you have added, I get an error screen from the dish receiver that forces me to fish out the dish remote, and channel up or down to get past the error. It also screws up timed recordings 'cause you can't enter channel numbers after that error appears on the screen. This happens all on it's own if Tivo decides that I might like to have it record some content on one of these channels that has been automagically added without asking me.

Instead of JAG, I got a whole hour of "This is a subscription channel that has not been purchased....." because Tivo decided to record cops from a Fox feed that I don't get. Of course - and this will offend those that take the position that Tivo can do no wrong - Tivo has NO reason to try to make using Tivo with dish easy. They have a vested interest in Directv. I do not buy that there was a necessity to screw with all those people that were using the dish "temporary lineup".

You've got all those cable company lineups all over the country that have to be available. Messing with that one lineup affected more people than ANY cable lineup would have. Again: Why not create lineups for dish that match whats really available? There's only five "real" packages. Build those, and let those that add HBO, locals, etc. ADD what they've added instead of having the rest of us try to keep up with deleting things we don't have?

Keep it up. There's others out there that are getting just as disgusted at Tivo for playing these games, but you don't know about them because they don't post here, and as you well know, you guys have made it impossible to reach customer support. It boils down to the typical, "Customer-no-service" attitude so prevelant today. You're collecting the money from me / us, what do you care how we like being treated, as long as the money keeps coming in.

BTW: If you want to figure out who I am, the last four of my SN are EBFF, and I can be reached at 910-383-xxxx.

Posted by: pv

You do have a really good point about channel selection. There needs to be a better identifier on the channel names on that list - it's incredibly irritating to get rid of all the sports channels on direct tv, for example. PV

Posted by: dgh

quote:
Originally posted by N2qew
Now I'm back to receiving to endless messages of "A lineup change has occurred"....

I've had TiVo on Dish for nearly 4 years and I stopped paying attention to those after the first few weeks. It's weird but a lot of time it just seems like some channel I've never heard of gets added to 652 and then a few days later there's another message that says it was removed.

quote:
Originally posted by N2qew
If I do a channel up past one of those channels that you have added, I get an error screen from the dish receiver that forces me to fish out the dish remote, and channel up or down to get past the error.

My initial setup was a major pain because of this - but I really consider the receiver lockup thing to be a HUGE Dish design goof but...

quote:
Originally posted by N2qew
It also screws up timed recordings 'cause you can't enter channel numbers after that error appears on the screen. This happens all on it's own if Tivo decides that I might like to have it record some content on one of these channels that has been automagically added without asking me.

I swear that in nearly 4 years, this has NEVER happened to me. Not once. I just looked at the most recent channels added messages (only because your post made me worry) and all of them were turned "off" in channels I receive. In fact it even says in the messages that you need to go turn them "on" if you receive them. They get added and turned on on your TiVo? Are you sure it wasn't something else like leaving an unsubscribed channel turned on in your initial setup (a pain I agree) or a simple IR misfire (also a pain - but again I blame Dish for these lockups much more than TiVo.)

quote:
Originally posted by N2qew
Of course - and this will offend those that take the position that Tivo can do no wrong - Tivo has NO reason to try to make using Tivo with dish easy. They have a vested interest in Directv.

Well maybe, but like I said, this stuff just doesn't happen to me so I think there must be something that can be fixed for you if we figure out what's different.

I had a few problems with getting stuck on these channels in the first months but one day I sat down and used TiVo to channel up through my entire line up. It turned out that I had something like 4 channels remaining that I thought I received but I didn't. Since they weren't channels I watched, the problem only showed up slowly as TiVo decided to record suggestions from them. (I also had some IR misfires which I resolved - at least to 99.99+%.) I haven't found my TiVo stuck on an unsubscribed channel in several years and the last one was due to an IR misfire.

I do agree that it would be nice to have TiVo line-ups that match Dish packages though.

Posted by: N2qew

quote:
Originally posted by dgh
I've had TiVo on Dish for nearly 4 years and I stopped paying attention to those after the first few weeks. It's weird but a lot of time it just seems like some channel I've never heard of gets added to 652 and then a few days later there's another message that says it was removed.

The complaint on my part is that Dish isn't really making these changes - at least not in the package I have.

quote:
My initial setup was a major pain because of this - but I really consider the receiver lockup thing to be a HUGE Dish design goof but...

If you look at what the intended method of control is - human at IR end of remote - it's really not Dish's fault. Tivo is trying to control it blindly, but, then again, unlike with Directv, there's no choice. One possible solution is to do a channel up code prior to sending the channel.

quote:
I swear that in nearly 4 years, this has NEVER happened to me. Not once. I just looked at the most recent channels added messages (only because your post made me worry) and all of them were turned "off" in channels I receive. In fact it even says in the messages that you need to go turn them "on" if you receive them. They get added and turned on on your TiVo? Are you sure it wasn't something else like leaving an unsubscribed channel turned on in your initial setup (a pain I agree) or a simple IR misfire (also a pain - but again I blame Dish for these lockups much more than TiVo.)

The channels that I mentioned were not there during the most recent re-setup. It found a cops show that it tried to record. It was on some local FOX that it don't receive. It went there, and got stuck. No JAG later.

quote:
Well maybe, but like I said, this stuff just doesn't happen to me so I think there must be something that can be fixed for you if we figure out what's different.

quote:
I had a few problems with getting stuck on these channels in the first months but one day I sat down and used TiVo to channel up through my entire line up. It turned out that I had something like 4 channels remaining that I thought I received but I didn't. Since they weren't channels I watched, the problem only showed up slowly as TiVo decided to record suggestions from them. (I also had some IR misfires which I resolved - at least to 99.99+%.) I haven't found my TiVo stuck on an unsubscribed channel in several years and the last one was due to an IR misfire.

Speaking of IR misfires, about three months ago, Tivo basically refused to do any IR control from either emitter. It wasn't the dish receiver because the real remote, and a second source remote worked fine.

quote:
I do agree that it would be nice to have TiVo line-ups that match Dish packages though.

Posted by: dgh

quote:
Originally posted by N2qew
The complaint on my part is that Dish isn't really making these changes - at least not in the package I have.

Well I just got a Holliday channel that is a real addition and probably will go away in a month. Normally I don't even read these.

quote:
Originally posted by N2qew
If you look at what the intended method of control is - human at IR end of remote - it's really not Dish's fault.

Even for human control they shouldn't make me read a screen to find instructions on how to get out of a trap that I got into just by mistyping a number. I instinctively just want to press numbers again. There have been many complaints about this and I think Dish has even said that they might fix it. Plus the fact that Dish is the only one I know of that does this just makes them the odd man out. Frankly their whole UI design is not so great in my opinion but fortunately I normally don't see it.

quote:
Originally posted by N2qew
The channels that I mentioned were not there during the most recent re-setup. It found a cops show that it tried to record. It was on some local FOX that it don't receive. It went there, and got stuck. No JAG later.

That's strange. That has never happened to me and I get new channels all the time. Did your message for the fox channel tell you that you had to go to channels I receive and turn it on if you receive it? Has anyone else seen a TiVo add a new channel and mark it as received?