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pre-order
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Posted by: drewba
quote:
Originally posted by DTV TiVo Dealer
On March 31 '04 we are scheduled to receive 200 and ship 200 HR10-250's. Each succeeding week we will receive substantial inventory of HR10-250's until all orders are filled
I'm a new DirecTV customer. Have you determined when you will be shipping out the dish and scheduling installation?
I'd like to have it installed and running by the time the Masters starts on April 8th.
Posted by: dswallow
quote:
Originally posted by DTV TiVo Dealer
Shipping from CA
OK, I would like to officially change my shipping arrangements to next-day air. What do I need to do in order to accomplish this? Call? EMail? Visit you in NY?
I'm sure this is going to be a common question (as will be those wanting to switch to ground shipping)... so I ask in public. ;)
Posted by: Shark73
Robert,
Do you plan to communicate with the first 200 via email to ensure our paper work was received and our desired shipping method is accurate?
Jim
Posted by: wmillik
Yahoo! Thanks Robert. I'll just stay home all week.
Posted by: micah67
Any possibility for an option to come and pick it up for those of us living in San Diego/LA?
Posted by: hongcho
Doug, you are going to miss your 2-page interval. :)
Hong.
Posted by: neilaevans
Robert,
I'm guessing the answer is no, but any chance those of in southern california can arrange a local pickup with you rather than wait for shipping?
Only those of us in the first 20 or so should be eligible for this local pickup, I'd say :)
EDIT: I knew I was typing too slowly. Sorry for the repeat question.
Posted by: Craig540
Robert will you be sending out Emails to let us Preorders below 300 know for sure what order number we are . I never recieved an Email.
Thanks
Craig
Posted by: dswallow
quote:
Originally posted by hongcho
Doug, you are going to miss your 2-page interval. :)
I just reposted it at 5:27pm ET at the top of page 65, but yeah, I'm probably gonna miss the next once since I'll be driving home and stopping at the grocery store too during the time it's likely to occur, but we'll see. ;)
Posted by: ken erickson
Robert,
Will you require a signature for those of us using Fed Ex 2 day air? Or will the delivery person be allowed to drop the package without a signature?
Posted by: DTV TiVo Dealer
quote:
Originally posted by Craig540
Robert will you be sending out Emails to let us Preorders below 300 know for sure what order number we are . I never recieved an Email.
Thanks
Craig
Doug's list is very accurate. However, anyone is welcome to call or PM me or anyone in my office regarding their position.
Posted by: hongcho
BTW, was there something important with the Q1 release? Looking at the date, it seems DirecTV was trying to make the Q1 date, the last one at that. :)
Hong.
Posted by: grins
doug gettin' props from Robert :D
t
Posted by: dswallow
quote:
Originally posted by ken erickson
Robert,
Will you require a signature for those of us using Fed Ex 2 day air? Or will the delivery person be allowed to drop the package without a signature?
What's your delivery address? I could use a second one of these things. :D
Posted by: dave3
I just did a quick analaysis.
1. I am going to be in the second weeks allocation.
2. If the planets are all alligned and they ship the same day they receive the shipment on 4/7 then I will receive my HDtivo on 4/13 via ups ground.
3. This is one whole day after my prediction of 4/12 at 4:30p.m.
GRRRRRRRRRRRRRR
Time to go home and see the boys. talk to you all tommorow.
Posted by: Shark73
Looks like Thursday April 1st will be a sick day....I'm feeling a cold coming on already!!! :D
Posted by: Darin
quote:
Originally posted by joegolf68
I said if Voom got enough people to go there, D* would be forced, via competition, to increase HD choices.
Personally, I disagree. Only 2% of DirecTV's customers have HD. Subtract from that the number of people who won't switch to Voom because Voom doesn't have ESPN, or any other number of SD channels that are important to them, those who have multiple TVs and the HW cost (or lease cost) would be probative, those who are skeptical it won't last, those who can't get it because their sat is much lower in the sky, those who think Vooms HD advantage is going to be very short-lived due to their bandwidth limitations, those who have a fear of dealing with a company owned by Cablevision, those who have brand loyalty to DirecTV, and those who simply think Voom doesn't have that much more REAL HD content than DirecTV, and you are left with a very very small percentage of DirecTV's customer base.
I think Voom is an interesting concept, but at least a couple of the issues I mention above are big enough to me to keep me where I am, at least for now. I just don't see Voom as a real threat to DirecTV. At least not yet. By the time they have overcome many of those issues, their HD advantage could disappear.
Posted by: AV8NDV8
WooHoo! I should have it on 4/2 or 4/5. Damn weekends.............
Posted by: Kamakzie
so April 7 should be the 2nd shipment?
Posted by: PJO1966
So much for my optimistic delivery date... April Fools Day it is...
Posted by: poolne1
Installed my multiswitch this weekend. Can't wait for HD Tivo. Next up, Playboy HD, I hope.
Posted by: dlott
At 122 was concerned that Robert wouldn't get an entire allocation of 200 in the first shipment. Can call my buds and tell them we are watching the finals in HD!!!! Life is good. Thanks Robert and Doug.:)
Posted by: K-bueno
Robert- As others have requested...I too would like to know if it would be possible to pick up in the San Diego location, or if not, change my shipping options, since overnight would be a waste of money.
Posted by: midas
quote:
Originally posted by joegolf68
And for the person that asked if I saw the Master's in HD last year. No. I just bought the HD TV and Samsung before this year's Super Bowl. Yep, got to be one of the one's using the TiVo to look at Janet's show.
Joe
Well looks like unless 30 people cancel before the first ship date, I'll miss The Masters this year. I would pay to upgrade the shipping, but being unemployed that just wouldn't make much financial sense. Heck, even still buying this doesn't make much sense but that's another story for another time.
Anyway, there are 2 things that will stand out about The Masters. First will be just how spectactular it looks. CBS broadcasts in 1080i. This gives a level of detail that is just stunning. For the first time you'll get a true appreciation of why Augusta is considered such a tough course. There's no way on a regular broadcast for you to get a sense of just how nasty those greens are. I'd be looking at a 50 putt round.
The second thing, not so good, is that there will still be plenty of non-HD cameras and those shots will not look so good. Unfortunately there are still no wirelss handheld HD cameras yet.
Oh, and don't forget the Thursday and Friday HD coverage!
Posted by: jjmpeters
Robert,
When will the beyond 350 be notified of their place in line? With my order being #12954, and the 350th unit being #12868, I fear I am dangerously close to the 450 cutoff for the first two shipments.
Thanks!
Posted by: RxMan
What would be the best guess for people at the very bottom of the list?
How many total pre-orders were taken?
Posted by: EJ
I received a message from Robert. I am #143 on the list. (For the record)
Posted by: madpoet
Bottom of the list people is probably mid-late April.
Posted by: Will-san
I don't get home from Hong Kong till April 2. This thing could beat me home.
Mr Burns voice: EXCELENT!
Posted by: Todd
quote:
Originally posted by midas
Anyway, there are 2 things that will stand out about The Masters. First will be just how spectactular it looks. CBS broadcasts in 1080i. This gives a level of detail that is just stunning. For the first time you'll get a true appreciation of why Augusta is considered such a tough course. There's no way on a regular broadcast for you to get a sense of just how nasty those greens are. I'd be looking at a 50 putt round.
The second thing, not so good, is that there will still be plenty of non-HD cameras and those shots will not look so good. Unfortunately there are still no wirelss handheld HD cameras yet.
I hope they do a better job than last year's Masters which was a mess in HD. The picture wasn't that good and the sound was screwed up thoughout much of the weekend. INHD was showing the ProAm at Pebble Beach recenty in HD and that looked awesome. I swear I don't understand how this little networks can do more stuff in HD than the big networks...
Posted by: Shark73
quote:
Originally posted by Todd
I hope they do a better job than last year's Masters which was a mess in HD. The picture wasn't that good and the sound was screwed up thoughout much of the weekend. INHD was showing the ProAm at Pebble Beach recenty in HD and that looked awesome. I swear I don't understand how this little networks can do more stuff in HD than the big networks...
Well, INHD only did one hole and it was a par three which only required a couple of cameras. That is much easier than doing all 18 holes.
Posted by: aaronwt
quote:
Originally posted by DTV TiVo Dealer
Forum members get an additional 10% discount or free shipping. I appreciate all accessory business and will ship immediately!
I never received a discount when I ordered my Squareshooter from you. I preordered the HD-TiVo in January and ordered the SqS on FEB14. I paid regular price and paid for shipping as well. Since I didn't get that discount and free shipping is there anyway to get free ground shipping for the HD-TiVo instead?
Posted by: Gromit
I agree with Doug: I gotta change my shipping now. The Final Four is the 3rd and the 5th.
Robert, can you let us know the best way to upgrade our shipping?
Posted by: Shark73
Gromit,
I would call....Robert is bound to get a ton of PM's and emails in the coming days. A phone call would ensure that your shipping is changed correctly.
Jim
Posted by: Todd
quote:
Originally posted by Shark73
Well, INHD only did one hole and it was a par three which only required a couple of cameras. That is much easier than doing all 18 holes.
They only did 1 hole? I guess I only watched a few minutes of it.... :eek:
Posted by: aaronwt
quote:
Originally posted by aaronwt
I never received a discount when I ordered my Squareshooter from you. I preordered the HD-TiVo in January and ordered the SqS on FEB14. I paid regular price and paid for shipping as well. Since I didn't get that discount and free shipping is there anyway to get free ground shipping for the HD-TiVo instead?
I misread it as free shipping and a 10% discount. Anyway I never received either one with my SqS order. I sent an email to you. Thanks.
Posted by: Shark73
quote:
Originally posted by Todd
They only did 1 hole? I guess I only watched a few minutes of it.... :eek:
Yes, the par three 7th which has the ocean as its backdrop. You do know that CBS has announced many PGA events will be in HD this year starting with the Masters?
He is a link to the thread at AVS.
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/show...threadid=374596
Jim
Posted by: Todd
Yeh, I know about CBS and PGA HD. I was using the INHD Pebble Beach thing as an example, but kind of a bad example after thinking about it. Oh well, I can't wait to be able to record this HD stuff!!!
Posted by: Shark73
Just wanted to bring it to your attention if you did not know!
CBS going HD with golf and the HD TiVo being released is going to make April a very good month for me.
Posted by: DTV TiVo Dealer
quote:
Originally posted by RxMan
What would be the best guess for people at the very bottom of the list?
How many total pre-orders were taken?
Shipped by the beginning of May '04 or sooner
Posted by: DTV TiVo Dealer
quote:
Originally posted by aaronwt
I never received a discount when I ordered my Squareshooter from you. I preordered the HD-TiVo in January and ordered the SqS on FEB14. I paid regular price and paid for shipping as well. Since I didn't get that discount and free shipping is there anyway to get free ground shipping for the HD-TiVo instead?
The easiest way for us to adjust shipping or provide credits is for you to fax me at 914-472-6364. I am answering PM's as fast as I can and deleting as I go along as my PM box is near it's capacity. Faxing is easier for us to manage.
New orders placed on our shopping cart will be shipped the same day or the following day for sure and automatically discounted by 10% or given free shipping, whichever is cheaper for our customers.
Posted by: dswallow
quote:
Originally posted by midas
Well looks like unless 30 people cancel before the first ship date, I'll miss The Masters this year. I would pay to upgrade the shipping, but being unemployed that just wouldn't make much financial sense. Heck, even still buying this doesn't make much sense but that's another story for another time.
Pay for upgraded shipping. Get the unit. Watch the Masters. Then you can sell it on EBay for a premium since they still won't be generally available. ;)
Posted by: dswallow
Order listing moved, for convenience, to http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-v...295#post1827295
Posted by: Bill N
one more to put in the kitty......
Time of Order: 1/18/2004 12:55:26 AM
Order Type: Email
Order ID: 12703
que #234
Posted by: LarryInAz
I'm wanting to verify how Robert plans on shipping the HD TiVo?
On the VE web sight it specifically says UPS, others have mentioned on this thread FedEx. From past business [always good experiences I might add] VE has used both shippers.
I'm hoping [and praying] UPS is the shipper of choice. If the first batch does go out on Wednesday March 31 from the left coast, UPS Ground takes 2 business days to arrive in Arizona meaning it will arrive Friday in time for the weekend. :cool:
FedEx Express takes 3 business days which means Monday. :eek:
Posted by: elstonhill
Here is a question that has not been asked.
I live on the Strait of Juan de Fuca across from Victoria. I have no OTA stations from the US but do get Canadian stations from Victoria. Will the TIVO guide give me the Canadian stations?
Posted by: KCWolfPck
quote:
Originally posted by elstonhill
Here is a question that has not been asked.
I live on the Strait of Juan de Fuca across from Victoria. I have no OTA stations from the US but do get Canadian stations from Victoria. Will the TIVO guide give me the Canadian stations?
2 questions....
1) They have TVs in Canada?
2) If yes to 1, they have HDTV in Canada??
Posted by: dswallow
quote:
Originally posted by elstonhill
Here is a question that has not been asked.
I live on the Strait of Juan de Fuca across from Victoria. I have no OTA stations from the US but do get Canadian stations from Victoria. Will the TIVO guide give me the Canadian stations?
Do you have a regular DirecTV HD receiver now? If you have guide data now on those locals, I'd say you have a good chance with TiVo. Are any Canadian stations actually broadcasting ATSC, though?
I've not heard of anyone talking about this particular issue before, though I have recently seen mention people in the US near Mexico do get some stations broadcasting in Mexico as part of their DirecTV locals, so there's at least a chance that they might have guide data for near-border Canadian OTA stations.
Posted by: elstonhill
quote:
Originally posted by KCWolfPck
2 questions....
1) They have TVs in Canada?
2) If yes to 1, they have HDTV in Canada??
1. I believe this TIVO records both regular TV and HDTV. Right?
2. Second, applications have been made to build and license an HDTV station in Vancouver (which I might also be able to get).
Posted by: jdk
It will record ATSC and/or DirecTV signals. I'm not sure if by "regular TV", you mean ATSC or NTSC. If will NOT record NTSC.
Posted by: hongcho
> I believe this TIVO records both regular TV and HDTV. Right?
It will record "regular TV" and HD signals from DirecTV and ATSC signals from an OTA antena.
However, OTA "regular TV", which is analog, cannot be recorded by HR10-250. Only digital signals can be recorded.
Hong.
Posted by: MikeSRC
quote:
Originally posted by LarryInAz
I'm hoping [and praying] UPS is the shipper of choice. If the first batch does go out on Wednesday March 31 from the left coast, UPS Ground takes 2 business days to arrive in Arizona meaning it will arrive Friday in time for the weekend. :cool:
FedEx Express takes 3 business days which means Monday. :eek:
I've shipped a lot of products via FedEx Ground to the Phoenix area and they always only take two days. You should be fine either way.
Posted by: djgdg
A little late but here's my order info for the list:
Order Date: 1/16/2004 6:55:52 PM
Order Type: Email
Order ID: 12579
The email I got 3/4 from VE says I am number 105.
Dave
Posted by: LarryInAz
quote:
Originally posted by MikeSRC
I've shipped a lot of products via FedEx Ground to the Phoenix area and they always only take two days. You should be fine either way.
I know sometimes Fedex can make it in 2 days, however I'm going by what UPS.COM and FEDEX.COM say in their calculated time charts. UPS promises two business days and Fedex three. Also UPS is considerably cheaper when you compare ground shipping between the two companies. If 2-day or overnite is requested than the charges are similar.
Posted by: dswallow
quote:
Originally posted by LarryInAz
I know sometimes Fedex can make it in 2 days, however I'm going by what UPS.COM and FEDEX.COM say in their calculated time charts. UPS promises two business days and Fedex three. Also UPS is considerably cheaper when you compare ground shipping between the two. If 2-day or overnite is requested than the charges are similar.
Neither online rate chart represents anything close to what a regular shipper with an account will pay.
Posted by: ptrubey
My info:
Time of Order: 1/22/2004 7:38:42 PM
Order Type: Email
Order ID: 13005
FOR TWO UNITS
I faxed in my two forms a while back, but did not receive any kind of acknowledgement. Should I have received something?
Posted by: LarryInAz
quote:
Originally posted by dswallow
Neither online rate chart represents anything close to what a regular shipper with an account will pay.
FWIW, I understand that. My business has an account with both FedEx and UPS and I was getting an estimate from both as if I were sending a 25# package from San Diego to Phoenix.
I was more interested in the shipping time than the charges though.
Posted by: DTV TiVo Dealer
No problem transferring your pre-order to another person, as long as they qualify as a new or existing DIRECTV subscriber who will sign a DIRECTV activation agreement and ValueElectronics.com charge card agreement.
Posted by: cptkleid
Just got a PM from Robert. I did not receive my place in line but was told to expect shipment by the 3rd week in April. Unless there were over 100 orders between 10am and 2pm on 1/19 I should definitely be in the first 450 meaning I should be in the second shipment. This indicates to me that either Robert is just being conservative with his shipping estimate or that the second shipment may not come in exactly a week after the first one. I am definitely hoping it is the former ;)
Posted by: joegolf68
Selling one's list in line is both wrong and very possibly illegal in a civil court! Robert, you are opening yourself up to a lawsuit, I assure yoiu.
Posted by: TallGuy
Come on. It's not much different than buying the unit from VE and selling it on eBay the next minute.
Posted by: DTV TiVo Dealer
Joe, actually I agree with you, however, I want to be a fair as possible with everyone. The extremely few, (actually 3) people who have requested a refund of the deposit have been very upset when I told them that the deposit and sale is not cancelable. One person told me he is an attorney and will sue me and blast me on every forum.
Personally, I do not know exactly what's the best way to handle these very rare incidents. I do not want anyone to be unhappy doing business with me or my company and I tend to be very easy with almost all customer requests.
Posted by: jdk
What laws are being broken by transferring or selling one's place in line? Its something someone probably paid for. Why can't they then decide to sell it? Also, as stated above, why is it illegal on 3/30, but legal on 4/2 - the only difference being that a physical thing is in someone's hands?
The morality is up for debate (personally, I have no problem with it), but I'm curious what the legal implications are ( not that I'm going to do it).
Posted by: dswallow
quote:
Originally posted by joegolf68
Robert, I respectfully disagree. After reading and rereading the contract you stated on your website, I believe if you transfer orders from one person to another is a breach of contract and I WILL take action. Sorry to be so forward but I believe it is wrong for others to profit by this. My legal basis will be your statements always included "YOU" as in the person who ordered.
3. No deposit is required however, here's another option. For every dollar you pay in as a deposit I will match your down-payment with equal dollars off the selling price; up to a maximum of $100.00. Hence, if you put $25.00 down I will extend you a $25.00 discount. As another example, if you put down the maximum deposit of $100.00 I will discount the product by an additional $100.00 and your balance due when we ship will be $799.99.
4. Advance orders are accepted on a first come first served basis.
5. All orders are final and I will refund 100% of the money, upon request, only if you can purchase the HD-DVR250 anywhere else sooner than I can ship.
There is no provision for transferring orders and the statement that first come first serve is pretty clear. Now if someone wants to buy the unit, take possession and then sell to another, that is fine, but it is a clear violation of precedent law that one can sell their position. I assure you I am serious.
I could have bought a unit as a gift or on behalf of a friend. In fact, as noted in my list one person is buying 3 units, one for himself and 2 others for people who wanted one -- and he just took care of "the paperwork" of ordering for them.
I could call Robert and give him "my credit card" for the balance of the payment. He has no idea if it's me, my roommate, my parents, a friend with a credit card, or a total stranger. Similarly, I can turn in the paperwork for the DirecTV contract; all they want is the customer ID, and a signature, or that it's for a new install. That person doesn't have to be the same one who's paying for the unit. And the credit card agreement doesn't have to be the same person who's activating the unit.
No, I don't particularly care that someone who doesn't want one is profiting (or at least trying to profit) from it, but the alternative for that person is to lose their deposit, and nothing's stopping them, as you said, from selling the unit once they took delivery. I'd rather Robert be "a nice guy" and just allow someone to replace the original purchaser than to force the original purchaser to complete the transaction in order to resell the unit... either way, if I were further down the list, I'm unaffected. No harm. No basis for a claim anyway. And this way Robert does a good thing for someone finding themselves in a financial bind without doing harm to himself, either.
So there's several approaches to refute the legal claim you're trying to assert.
Posted by: SocalDave
I'm not trying to screw anyone over, I acutally really want the Tivo, I just cant handle it right now since I am now unemployed. I respect the fact that Robert has said all sales are final and I have not specifically asked for a refund. I want to do business with VE when I do have a job and the money for the HD Tivo. But, he has set a precident (no one had a problem when someone sold their place in line at cost, how is it any different if I give my place in line for free or if I get a few extra bucks to help pay my mortgage for the month).. and I have decided to take advanage of the precident set. My plan was to pay for the box, activate it, deactivate it and then sell it on eBay (so that the agreements and such are taken care of), this just makes it simpler for everyone.
Posted by: DTV TiVo Dealer
BTW, here's the stories of the 3 people who requested a cancellation and deposit refund:
One is a Marine and was sent to Kuwait, another person lost his job and can't afford to go ahead with the sale and the final person ordered a new DIRECTV system from my competitor and says he has "no line of site". The last guy is the attorney who wants to damage my reputation.
Posted by: dswallow
In retrospect, Robert should've had a transfer fee... at least something to cover his extra effort involved in handling such a transfer. $25 or something, for instance.
But I don't see anything terribly wrong with the concept, though I cringe a bit at profiting from it without "investing" in it (as in putting out the full cost like you're buying it then reselling it) -- it's sorta like stock options. :)
I'd give some considerations to selling mine... if the money was right. Of course, to me, it'd take a LOT of money to make me agree to wait till a later date for this thing. But a couple thousand dollars and I'd seriously sit down and think about it accepting it.
Posted by: dswallow
quote:
Originally posted by DTV TiVo Dealer
the final person ordered a new DIRECTV system from my competitor and says he has "no line of site". The last guy is the attorney who wants to damage my reputation.
Did you tell him that based on reports in this forum, there's probably at least an 85% chance he really does have line of sight, and about a 90% chance he had a really lazy and incompetent installer?
Posted by: dswallow
quote:
Originally posted by SocalDave
I'm not trying to screw anyone over, I acutally really want the Tivo, I just cant handle it right now since I am now unemployed. I respect the fact that Robert has said all sales are final and I have not specifically asked for a refund. I want to do business with VE when I do have a job and the money for the HD Tivo. But, he has set a precident (no one had a problem when someone sold their place in line at cost, how is it any different if I give my place in line for free or if I get a few extra bucks to help pay my mortgage for the month).. and I have decided to take advanage of the precident set. My plan was to pay for the box, activate it, deactivate it and then sell it on eBay (so that the agreements and such are taken care of), this just makes it simpler for everyone.
Hey, you're not even in my list. You could at least give me the order info and your position in line so I can put you up there wherever you belong. ;)
Posted by: TallGuy
Guys and girls, when we were taking HD-TiVos too seriously and we fully realized it, this whole thread was funny. But if someone actually considers legal action against Robert over a minor change to a purchase of an electronic toy, that makes me sick. We Americans have to sue over everything now. No good deed goes unpunished.
Posted by: dswallow
Is anyone keeping a list of all the twists and turns this thread has taken during its short life? I almost think it'd be longer than my list!
Posted by: DTV TiVo Dealer
quote:
Originally posted by dswallow
Did you tell him that based on reports in this forum, there's probably at least an 85% chance he really does have line of sight, and about a 90% chance he had a really lazy and incompetent installer?
Yes I did. In fact, I love going out on jobs where the technician said "no line of site". We are successful more than 70% - 80 % of the time, where others have given up.
Posted by: jdk
I'm not an expert on the subject, but I've heard many stories of people selling their places in line for hot new cars. In fact, a friend was in line for a new Mercedes a few years ago, and got a $20K offer just to transfer his place in line - an offer he didn't refuse. Throught all these stories, I have yet to hear of any legal issues...
In fact, a quick search revealed this story. The NYT doesn't seem to mention any problems with it:
"Covet That Car? For a Price, You Can Cut in Line"
http://www.nytimes.com/2004/03/14/b...8&partner=ASAHI
So, if its OK for cars, why not HD DirecTivos?
Also, even though it seems that in our tort system anything goes... I still hope/dream that before any lawsuit is filed in this country, the basic questions is answered: "how am I being damaged or financially hurt?" As Doug stated earlier, there is no damage or financial harm in this specific situation.
Posted by: Alexander
Frankly, I don't understand why Robert decided to have a non-refundable deposit anyway. The hassle and ill-will (that's right--I don't like it when I have to place a non-refundable deposit) seem to outweigh the few orders that might otherwise cancel. I think most people who placed an order are drooling over this thing, and $100 off MSRP and early shipping are more than enough for them to go through with their orders.
Posted by: dswallow
quote:
Originally posted by DTV TiVo Dealer
Yes I did. In fact, I love going out on jobs where the technician said "no line of site". We are successful more than 70% - 80 % of the time, where others have given up.
I wonder if there'd be a market for a GPS-based kit that had 3 rifle scopes mounted on a small motorized platform with a level, a GPS, and an embedded PC; place it somewhere, press a button, look through all 3 scopes for obstructions... it'd be rather easy to make something like that.
There couild be an economy version with one scope and you just had to push a button 3 times and look each time. ;)
Posted by: dswallow
quote:
Originally posted by Alexander
Frankly, I don't understand why Robert decided to have a non-refundable deposit anyway. The hassle and ill-will (that's right--I don't like it when I have to place a non-refundable deposit) seem to outweigh the few orders that might otherwise cancel. I think most people who placed an order are drooling over this thing, and $100 off MSRP and early shipping are more than enough for them to go through with their orders.
Here's my guess why:
When Robert started this offer he had absolutely no idea how popular it would be. He was originally committing to Hughes for 350 units... let's say dealer cost is $700 (purely a guess, I have no idea, but I'm assuming there has to be some profit involved even after his discount -- though maybe it's on the backend as a spiff from DirecTV when activated), so he's committing $245,000 of his money to get these things. He had no idea he'd end up with several times more orders than 350; he had to be concerned of people dropping out 3 days beforehand and him being stuck with having a huge stock of these things somewhere and nobody interested in buying them.
Thankfully for him it turned out otherwise. But he was the one at risk; and it's only fair to ask others to assume some of that risk -- IN EXCHANGE FOR A DISCOUNT. The original purchaser could have not put a deposit down, NOT GOTTEN A DISCOUNT, and then not be in this position of potentially losing that deposit.
Posted by: Alexander
or you could just use the "protractor, string, and compass" method.
Posted by: DTV TiVo Dealer
quote:
Originally posted by dswallow
I wonder if there'd be a market for a GPS-based kit that had 3 rifle scopes mounted on a small motorized platform with a level, a GPS, and an embedded PC; place it somewhere, press a button, look through all 3 scopes for obstructions... it'd be rather easy to make something like that.
There couild be an economy version with one scope and you just had to push a button 3 times and look each time. ;)
Our tech's carry a surveyor's type hand held, swiss made tool that has a spotting scope built into a compass/inclinometer. We also set up the dish and our very expensive satellite meter, that confirms the 101/110/119 satellites to verify signal strength before we go ahead with the installation.
Posted by: dswallow
quote:
Originally posted by Alexander
or you could just use the "protractor, string, and compass" method.
Too much skill required for that. This has to be usable by the average satellite dish installer.
With your method the installer would have to be able to read a compass, read from a table showing headings and look angles, be able to hold the protractor level and be able to follow a straight line. Way over the top for most of 'em I suspect.
Heck, my unit wouldn't really even need rifle scopes -- Bounty paper towel cardboard tubes would work (or plastic versions so it's weatherproof).
Though maybe green lasers would be more fun. With the right motors, the unit could do double-duty as a nightclub light effect, too. ;) And with the right license, when the technology matures, the lasers could be replaced with more powerful ones that would "guarantee" line of sight, too.
Posted by: dswallow
quote:
Originally posted by DTV TiVo Dealer
Our tech's carry a surveyor's type hand held, swiss made tool that has a spotting scope built into a compass/inclinometer. We also set up the dish and our very expensive satellite meter, that confirms the 101/110/119 satellites to verify signal strength before we go ahead with the installation.
Definitely not the norm among installers. ;) Hey, did you notice this was your post #666?
Posted by: ptrubey
The guy threatening legal action comes across as a bit of a dolt. In civil actions, the first thing you ask is what damage did the aggrieved party suffer? In this case, the aggrieved party is someone down on the waiting list and he's being damaged by the vendor transfering a unit to someone else rather than having the unit not sold - by not selling the unit, presumably the aggrieved party would get their unit faster. Well, we're talking three units being transfered vs hundreds of units going out every week. Chances are very high (98 to 1) that the aggrieved party won't suffer any damage at all - he would get his unit at the same time under either scenario. In the unlikely case he got bumped due to the three units, he would have to wait one more week. Not much harm there. Worth thousands of dollars to launch a law suit? Not a chance.
By the way, no arguments about "principle" or what *might* happen if you had hundreds of transfers - civil suits are about what actually happened, not what might have happened.
But onto real concerns - should have I received some sort of acknowledgement after faxing in my DirecTV, etc. info?
Posted by: K-bueno
Anyone get an answer from Robert about picking up our Tivo directly in San Diego/L.A.??
Posted by: Cajonkev
quote:
Originally posted by Alexander
Frankly, I don't understand why Robert decided to have a non-refundable deposit anyway. The hassle and ill-will (that's right--I don't like it when I have to place a non-refundable deposit) seem to outweigh the few orders that might otherwise cancel. I think most people who placed an order are drooling over this thing, and $100 off MSRP and early shipping are more than enough for them to go through with their orders.
To tag along with Doug's thoughts there is also no real way to know how many people would "jump on board" just to jump off again if it suited them.
Each time that happened it would could cost VE the call (if placed on the Toll free line), the man-hours to process the order and then the cancellation (we already saw how overwhelmed they were with what DID happen), and then the merchant fee for the credit card processing.
Why set yourself up for all this grief when you know you are offering THE hot item at an incentive price already when you don't need/have to.
This in addition to the obvious aspect of Doug's post regarding the tying up of working capital/credit.
I think 3-4 "voiced" complaints/concerns over the policy is pretty low considering the total number of orders and better than what could/would have happened with an open-ended term.
Imagine the "list" with a bunch of revisions/cancellations and more PM's and calls regarding "I haven't seen a credit on my card yet, what's the deal"?
Posted by: BenWaldman
Another order for the list:
Time of Order: 1/26/2004 3:44:11 AM
Order Type: Email
Order ID: 13079
I haven't gotten my official position on the list, but I'm really hoping it's less than 450!
Posted by: dswallow
quote:
Originally posted by BenWaldman
I haven't gotten my official position on the list, but I'm really hoping it's less than 450!
If I had to hazard a guess, I'd put you around #600. But that's purely a guess based on what we've seen among the first 328 and how order numbers progressed. Based on that, it's probably safe to assume your unit is coming out of the 3rd weeks deliveries -- shipping April 14th-ish.
Posted by: mjoconnell
quote:
Originally posted by dswallow
If I had to hazard a guess, I'd put you around #600. But that's purely a guess based on what we've seen among the first 328 and how order numbers progressed. Based on that, it's probably safe to assume your unit is coming out of the 3rd weeks deliveries -- shipping April 14th-ish.
Doug you really think he is that far down? Looking at the list:
richhurley 1304x 1/23/2004 4:15:29 PM
"we are over the 350 mark" 1/23/2004 4:24 PM ......
code:
JLWINE 1304x 1/24/2004 12:51:50 AM
ArmyEagle 1306x 1/25/2004 1:36:29 PM
BigHat 13073 1/25/2004 5:57:40 PM
GScott 13074 (no date/time)
whiteal 13075 1/25/2004 6:31 PM
BenWaldman 13079 1/26/2004 3:44:11 AM
I would have expected him to be well within the first 450.
Posted by: dswallow
Order 12762 is #291
Order 12478 is #1
285 order numbers, 291 units ordered.
I'm sure this isn't how it is with orders today; Value Electronics sells other things online, but initially it looks like multiple unit orders and phone orders for the HD units pretty much offsets any non-HD orders online.
So with him at order 13079, it'd put him at #602. I think he's going to be right around there.
BTW, the ">#350" isn't meant to imply those before are <=#350; only that that specific person was told he was higher than #350. I'd put him closer to #390.
Posted by: Alexander
quote:
Originally posted by Cajonkev
Imagine the "list" with a bunch of revisions/cancellations and more PM's and calls regarding "I haven't seen a credit on my card yet, what's the deal"?
I was thinking more along the lines of how 99% of online stores handle pre-orders: You place your order, then your card is charged the full amount when it ships. Want to cancel before it ships? No problem.
It seems far-fetched to me that any dealer would be stuck with a just-released product that wouldn't be sellable for at least the wholesale price. Sure, the risk is not zero, but business is about risks, and Robert is currently reaping the reward of selling these to us at greater than his cost, so I don't see why his risk should be nullified at our expense.
Posted by: dswallow
quote:
Originally posted by Alexander
I was thinking more along the lines of how 99% of online stores handle pre-orders: You place your order, then your card is charged the full amount when it ships. Want to cancel before it ships? No problem.
It seems far-fetched to me that any dealer would be stuck with a just-released product that wouldn't be sellable for at least the wholesale price. Sure, the risk is not zero, but business is about risks, and Robert is currently reaping the reward of selling these to us at greater than his cost, so I don't see why his risk should be nullified at our expense.
But the deal was that if you placed a deposit, you got a discount equal to your deposit, up to $100, in exchange that deposit was non-refundable except under limited and clearly spelled out circumstances.
If you didn't place a deposit, you could cancel and walk away unharmed.
It was (and is) not a one-sided arrangement.
Posted by: tarmack
Doug,
I would say that you are pretty much spot on with the numbers....the estimated numbers.
I have an order number of 13113 and PM'd Robert yesterday evening...got a reply back in less than a half hour saying that my order standing would result in a shipment of the DVR in the 3rd week of April....maybe....the 4th week for sure.
So the guy with a number of 13079 looks pretty good for the 3rd set of shipments.
In my case....I could kick myself for delaying the order until I did....but..since I will be in my motorhome from April 1 through the 18th attending an airshow in Lakeland Fl....it all kinda worked out...the time will "fly" and when I get home I can just get out of the motorhome and sit on my doorstep watching for the delivery guy. Grin.
Tarmack
quote:
Originally posted by dswallow
Order 12762 is #291
Order 12478 is #1
285 order numbers, 291 units ordered.
I'm sure this isn't how it is with orders today; Value Electronics sells other things online, but initially it looks like multiple unit orders and phone orders for the HD units pretty much offsets any non-HD orders online.
So with him at order 13079, it'd put him at #602. I think he's going to be right around there.
BTW, the ">#350" isn't meant to imply those before are <=#350; only that that specific person was told he was higher than #350. I'd put him closer to #390.
Posted by: midas
quote:
Originally posted by dswallow
Pay for upgraded shipping. Get the unit. Watch the Masters. Then you can sell it on EBay for a premium since they still won't be generally available. ;)
Well that ain't gonna happen!!!! I've waited over 2 years for this thing and once it arrives I'm not letting it go.
Actually, I got $355 for my old HD receiver and I'll be selling a regular DirecTivo when the new one arrives. I should easily get $150 if not more for it. Then if I can call D* and get some kind of discount I'll be close to the purchase price.
Believe me, if I were working I'd be upgrading the shipping, no doubt. But I have to be cheap right now.
Posted by: BillF
"The last guy is the attorney who wants to damage my reputation."
And....that's why 99 percent of the lawyers give the others a bad name!!!
Posted by: JohnA
The way I look at my position, should be in the second shipment, order #1280#. Do you concur Doug?
Posted by: dswallow
quote:
Originally posted by JohnA
The way I look at my position, should be in the second shipment, order #1280#. Do you concur Doug?
I'd guess your position at around 345-350. That should be well within the second shipment.
Posted by: JohnA
QUOTE - "I bought the biggest one that my local installer could get his hands on. He told me it was overkill and intended for commercial purposes but I never believed in the overkill theory myself. I have to wait until it gets better outside so they can install it for me. My roof is very steep and I won't go on it myself. My current antenna is about 2/3 the size of the new one but it had trouble getting some of the HD channels previously."
Beware! In this application overkill can be a problem. Too strong a digital signal can overload an OTA tuner on most all types of digital tuners resulting in picture lock up or no picture at all. Know of people who have had to install attenuators when close to a strong signal to dampen the signal.
Posted by: Darin
quote:
Originally posted by TallGuy
Guys and girls, when we were taking HD-TiVos too seriously and we fully realized it, this whole thread was funny. But if someone actually considers legal action against Robert over a minor change to a purchase of an electronic toy, that makes me sick. We Americans have to sue over everything now. No good deed goes unpunished.
Exactly what I was thinking. You'd think Robert had the last loafs of bread in a famine stricken country. It's a freakin device to record television shows! If you "need" this thing that bad, then you need to get outside & enjoy life. If you don't want something you agreed to purchase, then sell it. Don't try to litigate yourself out of your commitments.
Posted by: JEbbesen
quote:
Originally posted by JohnA
QUOTE - "I bought the biggest one that my local installer could get his hands on. He told me it was overkill and intended for commercial purposes but I never believed in the overkill theory myself. I have to wait until it gets better outside so they can install it for me. My roof is very steep and I won't go on it myself. My current antenna is about 2/3 the size of the new one but it had trouble getting some of the HD channels previously."
Beware! In this application overkill can be a problem. Too strong a digital signal can overload an OTA tuner on most all types of digital tuners resulting in picture lock up or no picture at all. Know of people who have had to install attenuators when close to a strong signal to dampen the signal.
I'm 40+ miles from the towers in chicago - shouldn't be a problem per my guy. (I think everyone should have a guy, don't you?)
Posted by: JEbbesen
quote:
Originally posted by Alexander
Frankly, I don't understand why Robert decided to have a non-refundable deposit anyway. The hassle and ill-will (that's right--I don't like it when I have to place a non-refundable deposit) seem to outweigh the few orders that might otherwise cancel. I think most people who placed an order are drooling over this thing, and $100 off MSRP and early shipping are more than enough for them to go through with their orders.
Why, because he could. It's the golden rule in action. Don't like it, don't pay it.
Posted by: dave3
I am sure this 'lawyer' is not really going to start a suit. He is just a lawyer who is pissed off cause he wants his money back, and he thinks he deserves it back.
In my business whenever one of my clients disagrees with me, and they happen to be a lawyer, automatically the whole "I will sue you" quote comes out. It is simply a scare tatic to get what they want since they know, that you know, a lawsuit costs more money to defend than it costs to just give in to what the client wants.
my 2 cents
Posted by: slocko
me's scratching me head. and he seemed like such a reasonable fellow too.
i bet even as unhappy as he is with Robert, he won't cancel his order :)
does anyone have any more information on Direct installing OTA antennas? I want to purchase the straightshooter, but several people in other places have mentioned that D* will start installing OTA antennas for HD customers.
Posted by: Kevin L
quote:
Originally posted by midas
I'd be looking at a 50 putt round.
I don't know what your index is, but I'd say a 50 putt round at Augusta with greens prepped for the Masters would be damn good!
I average 30 putts a round. At Augusta, I gotta figure I'd at least double that. :)
Posted by: ferky1
Joegolf86 -
I am both a lawyer and a VE pre-orderer and I want to say that people like you, more importantly, lawyers like you, make me absolutely sick. Where do you get off threatening legal action in a case like this? You wonder why people hate lawyers? It's because of as*holes like you.
I won't get into the total and complete impotence of your argument, but I'd love to hear more "legal" theories of yours. . . . I need another laugh.
Robert has done nothing here but work hard to offer new and existing customers a great service in order to give the 'harder-core' electronics enthusiasts the opportunity to get one of these devices quickly. Your only concern should be the contract that you entered into with Robert, that contract said that your deposit was non-refundable so stop your belly-aching and get over yourself. Get the unit and enjoy it, sell your spot on the list, sell the unit once you receive it . . . do something more constructive than b*tching about Robert and his attempt to actually try to service the customer's needs. You make the rest of us look bad (VE preorderers AND lawyers!)
Posted by: jeffdoo
Well, I guess I'll share my order details so everyone in front of me can have a laugh :D
Time of Order: 2/24/04 @ 9:40PM
Order Method: Web
Order #: 13592
Here's hoping for May...
Posted by: Kevin L
Thank you ferky1. My sentiments exactly. I'm so sick of people in this country not wanting to take responsibility for their actions. Blame always has to be placed on someone or something else. NEWS FLASH - Sometimes when things go wrong in our lives, we're the ones to blame. Sometimes we screw up, trip over our own feet, don't see the car to our left, or fail to read a contract or have it reviewed by our attorney BEFORE signing.
I'm in the insurance business and I saw this change in attitued occur at about the same time lawyers were permitted to advertise a couple of decades ago.
Posted by: ebonovic
Now I have a question...
As rapidly as this thread grows... We lose site of the semi-important issues at hand... Especially when you don't read the thread for a few days, it is very time cosuming to catch up.
What is the latest estimated shipping date? For the top 10 orders?
Posted by: Shark73
Per Doug's list update
------------------------------------------------------
Summary of delivery/shipping info, last revised 3/22/2004 7:39 PM:
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
On 3/22/2004, Robert let us know the first 200 units ordered are scheduled to ship from California on 3/31/2004. The following week, the next approximately 250 units will ship from California. Each subsequent weeks shipments will occur from a variety of distribution points in the US, until all orders are filled.
You will get an email from Robert containing two forms to fill out regarding your order. One is a standard DirecTV commitment; the other is from Robert and contains the terms you've already seen when you placed your order online (regarding returns/cancelations) and also is helping him confirm your shipping desire and address and credit card to bill the balance to, in case you want it billed somewhere other than where the deposit was charged.
Those forms have to be returned to him before your unit ships, but otherwise has no effect on your order or position in the queue.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
__________________
Doug Swallow
doug@2150.com
Posted by: madpoet
Robert, I am in the same boat as the guy who says he can't get a shot. Once I talked to your installers and they gave me the angle and elevation for the 3 birds I need, I don't see how on earth I will be able to get them. I went up on my roof with a compass, a protractor, and a yard stick. My shot goes straight into the side of a hill that it about 40-50 feet away. In fact I've been working dilligently every day on the phone with Wendy to try and get one of your installer people out to take a look. But frankly, I'm not getting anywhere. This is a legitimate concern for me. Obviously if I can't see the birds, I can't get DirecTV service. And if I can't get the service, I violate the terms of the contract by not signing up in time. So are you saying that if it's physically impossible for me to make the shot, you are still going to force me to buy the receiver? Believe me, I want DirecTV HD. I will do everything in my power to get a shot at the birds. But if it can't happen, I have to hope that I'm not going to have to buy it and Ebay it just to get most of my money back.
I will add that Wendy has been very helpful. It's the install guys that have not been. I would have PM'd this, but I can never catch your box at an empty moment :)
-MP
Posted by: Marco
quote:
Originally posted by joegolf68
Selling one's list in line is both wrong and very possibly illegal in a civil court! Robert, you are opening yourself up to a lawsuit, I assure yoiu.
Well, there's ethics and then there's law ... the ethics here are roughly those of a scalper, but this member of the Virginia bar has no idea what cause of (legal) action you think you'd have.
Please, enlighten us as to your legal theory. I'm dying to find out whether it passes the "laugh" test. :D
Posted by: Kevin L
quote:
Originally posted by Marco
Well, there's ethics and there's law ... the ethics here are roughly those of a scalper, but this member of the Virginia bar has no idea what cause of (legal) action you think you'd have.
Please, enlighten us as to your legal theory. I'm dying to find out whether it passes the "laugh" test. :D
I can see the scalper analogy, but I don't think this is the case here. Yes, there is a possibility it will go above $100 on eBay, but the minimum bid was $100, so that's how much it will sell for if the one bid stands. Scalpers, OTOH, start with an asking price much higher than face value.
To me SocalDave is just looking to recoup his deposit. In fact, if it sells for the $100 listing price, he'll lose a little money, since there's a listing fee and final value fee due eBay. If it sells for more, so be it, it's a free market.
I'm not an attorney, but like you, I don't see where this is illegal.
Posted by: ebonovic
Would you believe that Robert's PM mailbox is full ?
Anyway, even though I faxed in the doc's and pre-ordered stating standard shipping...
Is there way to upgrade to overnight at this point?
With Illinois having a chance (slim that it may be) to be in the final four, I want to try to have the unit in place for the weekend (seeing that it may ship next Wednesday).
Sorry if this has been covered before, but the thread is so hugh... things get lost, and searches are not that exact enough.
Posted by: patjoy
For those that are having a tough time trying to locate a position for their single dish DTV installation. It may be necessary to find a location for a second dish that has a view of the sky. There are no rules against using this type of a solution but, Installers don't seem to suggest it. I once had the same problem. In my case some very tall trees were in the way of seeing the 119 sat. 101 was OK from my roof location, but not for 110 or 119. So got an 18 inch dish (had the LNB) and moved the dish South and further East on my lot and got it up 15 feet up on a big old tree. Not the best location but it worked! Only thing that stopped me was that the Squirrels found that they liked the taste of the coax and ate it all the way to the center conductor. System worked until they severed the shield. By then I had bought another house and moved. Leaving the coax for the squirrels to enjoy.
Posted by: subspace100
I'm so sick of all this law suit talk! I'm sure Robert has nothing to worry about (legally). He seems to have been totally above board in every respect.
The "worst" thing that jerkgolf68 err... I mean joegolf68 could do is try to bad mouth VE on the forums. In that case, I'm sure there would be a storm of opposing posts standing behind Robert and his business.
The thing that really has me stuck in a day dream right now is the thought of all the fully assembled and boxed up HDTiVos in that Mexican factory. Assuming that the began production yesterday, there are units just sitting there RIGHT NOW... waiting for a home and a couple SAT feeds. Its driving me nuts!
I wish I had pre-ordered in mid-January... I waited until Mar. 8th (for some inexplicable reason). You can bet though, I'll be checking the B&M stores in my area in early April. For now, I'll just have to waste away my days dreaming about the little HDTiVo in that Mexican factory. :(
Posted by: subspace100
quote:
Originally posted by patjoy
For those that are having a tough time trying to locate a position for their single dish DTV installation. It may be necessary to find a location for a second dish that has a view of the sky. There are no rules against using this type of a solution but, Installers don't seem to suggest it. I once had the same problem. In my case some very tall trees were in the way of seeing the 119 sat. 101 was OK from my roof location, but not for 110 or 119. So got an 18 inch dish (had the LNB) and moved the dish South and further East on my lot and got it up 15 feet up on a big old tree. Not the best location but it worked! Only thing that stopped me was that the Squirrels found that they liked the taste of the coax and ate it all the way to the center conductor. System worked until they severed the shield. By then I had bought another house and moved. Leaving the coax for the squirrels to enjoy.
I am very familiar with the tree problem. I actually had to use THREE individual dishes to get all three SATs from my house. Each one was placed in just the right spot to spy a somewhat limited LOS to its target. I actually purchased a 30" dish (used) which I now have in my garage waiting to go up. I'm waiting for the leaves to fill in this Spring. At that point I think the little 18" dish will probably loose 101 signal. My plan is to replace it with the 30" dish and hopefully improve the signal collection just enough to keep my HD programs flowing...
Feldon actually put together one of those nice wiring diagrams to show me how to connect my SAT-T60 SD DirecTiVo and the new HDTiVo (this diagram was never included in the FAQ). If it helps anyone, here it is...
http://www.feldoncentral.com/TiVo/direcTVmultiswitchHDTiVo3dishes.gif
Posted by: SteveWinNJ
quote:
Originally posted by ferky1
Joegolf86 -
I am both a lawyer and a VE pre-orderer and I want to say that people like you, more importantly, lawyers like you, make me absolutely sick. Where do you get off threatening legal action in a case like this? You wonder why people hate lawyers? It's because of as*holes like you.
I won't get into the total and complete impotence of your argument, but I'd love to hear more "legal" theories of yours. . . . I need another laugh.
Robert has done nothing here but work hard to offer new and existing customers a great service in order to give the 'harder-core' electronics enthusiasts the opportunity to get one of these devices quickly. Your only concern should be the contract that you entered into with Robert, that contract said that your deposit was non-refundable so stop your belly-aching and get over yourself. Get the unit and enjoy it, sell your spot on the list, sell the unit once you receive it . . . do something more constructive than b*tching about Robert and his attempt to actually try to service the customer's needs. You make the rest of us look bad (VE preorderers AND lawyers!)
Totally agreed. Although I don't even believe the buyer is a lawyer. He can easily sell for more than he paid and he is paying $100 under retail. Therefore there ARE NO DAMAGES. That's basic stuff. He either thinks he can BS Robert about a lawsuit and is a lawyer, or/but.. an actual lawyer would also know this post would laughed at by anyone in the know. Therefore, your honor, the man is a not a lawyer...but is in fact, an a-hole :)
Posted by: Darin
Same problem here. Huge tree right where it shouldn't be. I have one dish at the VERY corner of my roof at one end to just barely look around the SE corner of the tree to see 101, and a Dish500 at the opposite corner to just barely look around the NW corner of the tree to see 110 & 119. And in the middle of my roof are my two OTA antennas.
Looks kinda geeky, but what can you do?
Posted by: madpoet
If multiple dishes could solve my issues, I'd be all over it. But unless those dishes can levitate about 20' in the air, they aren't going to help me I don't think.
Posted by: Darin
Well, you could put one on a mast. But that's farther than I'd go.
EDIT: Hmmmmm top post on an odd numbered page.
THIS SPACE FOR SALE!!! :D
Posted by: MichaelK
YOU DA MAN!
quote:
Originally posted by ferky1
Joegolf86 -
I am both a lawyer and a VE pre-orderer and I want to say that people like you, more importantly, lawyers like you, make me absolutely sick. Where do you get off threatening legal action in a case like this? You wonder why people hate lawyers? It's because of as*holes like you.
I won't get into the total and complete impotence of your argument, but I'd love to hear more "legal" theories of yours. . . . I need another laugh.
Robert has done nothing here but work hard to offer new and existing customers a great service in order to give the 'harder-core' electronics enthusiasts the opportunity to get one of these devices quickly. Your only concern should be the contract that you entered into with Robert, that contract said that your deposit was non-refundable so stop your belly-aching and get over yourself. Get the unit and enjoy it, sell your spot on the list, sell the unit once you receive it . . . do something more constructive than b*tching about Robert and his attempt to actually try to service the customer's needs. You make the rest of us look bad (VE preorderers AND lawyers!)
Posted by: madpoet
Heh, I don't even like to think of the beating my wife would give me if I tried to mast-mount a dish 20' above our roof. Let's just say I would rather have the dish fall out of the sky and kill me :)
Posted by: SteveWinNJ
quote:
Originally posted by Shark73
Looks like SocalDave is doing well selling his place in line!
Yeah...I'd say he has covered his cost basis. ;)
Posted by: subspace100
quote:
Originally posted by Darin
Same problem here. Huge tree right where it shouldn't be. I have one dish at the VERY corner of my roof at one end to just barely look around the SE corner of the tree to see 101, and a Dish500 at the opposite corner to just barely look around the NW corner of the tree to see 110 & 119. And in the middle of my roof are my two OTA antennas.
Looks kinda geeky, but what can you do?
I've had to do a lot of explaining to my fiance about the "NORAD" look of our house. When I put the 30" dish up it'll probably spark roits in our cul-de-sac.
Posted by: MichaelK
quote:
Originally posted by madpoet
If multiple dishes could solve my issues, I'd be all over it. But unless those dishes can levitate about 20' in the air, they aren't going to help me I don't think.
wow that must be some big "hill" that close to your house.
something to keep in mind- many times you can actually go lower down the opposite side of the roof to gain some horizontal distance to the mountain. ALthough you are lower since you increased the distance it might work. There's abunch of dishes in my neighborhood that appear to aim straight into the peoples roofs but I assume they work just fine since there are a few of 'em.
Posted by: slocko
i have seen jacks that can lift an entire house and move it. nothing must get in the way of getting HD-Tivo :)
Posted by: madpoet
Heh, like I said... I hope my aim was off. Just talked with VE again (boy is Wendy tired of me!) and we're just going to go ahead and schedule the install for next week. If they get here and can't do it, supposedly I can return the equipment.
-MP
Posted by: dlott
I was just wanting to verify that the HR10-250 DirecTV HD DVR will be in your computer systems on 4/1/04. There will be approximately 200 units to be activated starting that date. I do not want go to activate my HR10-250 DirecTV HD DVR to be told that it is not in the computer. Thanks, if you will follow up on this it might save the CSR's and your customers a lot of grief.
Posted by: billcoff
When I first got D* about ten years ago, I lived in a mountenous community surrounded by 100 foot tall pine trees. I was thinking about Dish, but their satellite was at 62 degrees and I had absolutely no line of sight. However, there was about a 15 degree window to the south and I found I could get the D* satellite. Later on, when I installed a two LNB dish, I found a tree was blocking the second satellite, so I ended up installing my dish on that tree and running two 100 foot long cables to the dish. Then, when I got my DTC 100, I wanted to get OTA, but I lived in a small gully and had no signal with an antenna. So, I hired a tree climber who installed a UHF antenna on top of one of the 100 foot pine trees. Still not good enough to pull in the local tv staions whose towers were 65 miles away. I solved that by having the tree climber install another UHF antenna on top of the first one using a combiner. I was able to get three of the four stations that were transmitting digital at that time.
When I moved down to the valley and only 35 miles from the towers, figuring out OTA was duck soup compared to what I had been through.
Posted by: Cajonkev
quote:
Originally posted by Darin
Same problem here. Huge tree right where it shouldn't be. I have one dish at the VERY corner of my roof at one end to just barely look around the SE corner of the tree to see 101, and a Dish500 at the opposite corner to just barely look around the NW corner of the tree to see 110 & 119. And in the middle of my roof are my two OTA antennas.
Looks kinda geeky, but what can you do?
Geeky? You live in Georgia! What about your 15meter CB and 30meter Ham towers? For Pete's sake, try to keep up with your neighbors and at least go get a C-band dish for the back yard...:)
Posted by: Darin
quote:
Originally posted by subspace100
I've had to do a lot of explaining to my fiance about the "NORAD" look of our house. When I put the 30" dish up it'll probably spark roits in our cul-de-sac.
Heh, well I didn't mention that the one I have pointed at 101? is a 30" dish. :D Fortunately, that one is at the back corner of the house.
quote:
Originally posted by Cajonkev
...at least go get a C-band dish for the back yard...:)
Too many trees back there... no LOS. But now that you mention it... I live in a very "transitional" neighborhood. There is one house that had a c-band dish... in the FRONT yard. And that house had practically no front yard at all, so the dish WAS the front yard. That house burned, and while the LNB cover of the dish melted, they never took the dish down, they just put a DBS dish up on the (rebuilt) house instead. So I think I've got a ways to go before people start complaining about ME.
Posted by: madpoet
Darin, would that house be on blocks or still on it's wheels? :)
Just poking fun at my birth state. I lived in Cartersville for years and years.
Posted by: Darin
heh, no, it has a foundation. You don't find many of those wheeled contraptions inside 285. ;) I really should take a picture of the dish with the half melted LNB before someone with some sense buys that place and takes it down. No one would believe me otherwise.
Posted by: bpdp379
quote:
Originally posted by slocko
does anyone have any more information on Direct installing OTA antennas? I want to purchase the straightshooter, but several people in other places have mentioned that D* will start installing OTA antennas for HD customers.
When I did the $99 deal, they installed the Winegard GS-2000 amplified "wing" antenna. It was useless for me, only got one of the six I was hoping for.
I replaced it with a CM 4228, re-ran the coax, dumped the diplexers, and now I lock all the locals at 70 or above! :D
It was useful to let me know what to try. I just needed a very directional antenna. All the Seattle towers are within 7 degs from me....
Posted by: slocko
that particular offer was only for people in certain markets.
but it's my understanding that D* is going to offer it to everyone who wants HD locals to compete with Voom.
I am hopeful that I can pull in the main 3 I want with whatever they give me.
Posted by: joegolf68
Hey, I'm glad I made so much fodder for the thread last night. Funny how Robert, the one who drew up the original contract actually stated he AGREES with me. For those who said they are lawyers, I doubt that, as if you read my post again you will see you did not read it correctly the first time. Actually, I had two posts. The first one was rather straightforward threat of civil action. I regretted the wording of the first post and still do, that is why I deleted it, but Doug took it upon himself to repost it after it was deleted and I posted a more responsible post. The first post was there probably less than five minutes total.
The second post simply says that Robert is opening himself up to legal action. If you look at a car contract, I think you will find that it is not worded the same as Robert's. Robert's contract was pretty clear. But no, I am not taking any legal action but still believe Robert has opened himself up to problems. If shipments are delayed, or the buyer gets a DOA and paid a lot of money extra for getting it early, he will go to Robert and ask Robert to make it right.
Who is the Vermont lawyer???? People who don't read very well implied that was me. I never said I was a lawyer. But then again, several of the posts had much of the info inaccurate also, so no big deal. People read what they want, not what is sometimes there.
Now for anger. No one showed even the slightest contempt for those selling their place in line. Unethical as hell. Also, they placed a link to EBay here which is also against the rules. But because someone "Says" they lost their job, or maybe their mom needs an operation, we buy it and accept their greed. Pure and simple, they have broken Robert's rules and the rules of this community.
Have a great day.
Posted by: JEbbesen
quote:
Originally posted by joegolf68
No one showed even the slightest contempt for those selling their place in line. Unethical as hell.Have a great day.
Just 'cause you say it's so doesn't make it so.
Unethical how? For the buyer? For the seller? For other buyers? Inquiring minds want to know.
How does this change anything that negatively impacts anyone else?
I'm about 3XX or so in line, if everyone ahead of me were to sell their place in line, that impacts me how? Not at all AFAIK.
Posted by: Kamakzie
joegolf68 is a retired Fire fighter if I am not mistaken and not a lawyer. But anyways, I don't see the big deal about people selling their places in line. Robert wouldn't be profiting from the sale in line. The people behind that place in line wouldn't be getting their's any later then they were expecting. So big deal! Grow up folks there is more important things in life. Also the lawyer threatening to sue Robert should be disbarred for bringing frivolous lawsuits!
Posted by: dandrewk
quote:
Originally posted by joegolf68
Now for anger. No one showed even the slightest contempt for those selling their place in line. Unethical as hell. Also, they placed a link to EBay here which is also against the rules. But because someone "Says" they lost their job, or maybe their mom needs an operation, we buy it and accept their greed. Pure and simple, they have broken Robert's rules and the rules of this community.
Have a great day.
Question: I am in the market to buy a Toyota Prius. The demand for this vehicle outstrips supply, and dealers are taking advantage of the situation by adding premiums to the sticker price. Are those dealers wrong for doing this?
A few weeks ago, I was trying to buy a used IBM Thinkpad on ebay. There are always dozens and dozens of various models being auctioned. Yet, owing to their popularity, sellers are recouping nearly all of the original purchase price of their items, even though they are all used. Are these sellers wrong for getting such a high price?
You can't claim "anger" at somebody who sells their place in line, and not be angry at ANYONE who has a desirable item/situation for trying to profit on it. Just WHO is being harmed here, anyway?
It's called supply and demand. It's called capitalism. Look it up.
"Unethical as hell"? Give me a break...
Posted by: dr_mal
The only problem I could see with selling one's place in line is if someone preordered the first 100 units with the sole intent to sell those positions. That isn't the case here.
Funny how joegolf expects everyone to take him at face value when he says it's unethical and open for lawsuits (so far, joe, you haven't provided any evidence of harm to anybody) yet he won't believe someone who lost their job. It's gotta be devastating to lose your job and have to give up this awesome new toy, but then to have someone publically call you a liar as well?
Posted by: ebonovic
Question....
Will the Pre-Order thread die off once the unit's start to ship?
You need almost a catalog or index to parse through this 137 page novel.
Posted by: GreyGhost00
Boy this whole conversation is going to look REALLY stupid around the beginning of May when everyone here has their units.
I just ordered on the 11th of March, because it wasn't feasible for me until then. I wish I could receive my unit sooner, but have a pretty good feeling that I'll have one before May 1.
I won't be jealous if someone "buys into" a spot ahead of me -- my overall position didn't change at all. I imagine that the number of people shifting out of their place in line in going to be relatively small (THREE at this point), thus it's not going to change anyone's delivery date anyhow.
Quit 'yer bitchin.
Posted by: joegolf68
Simple, if the original contract were enforced, there will be three people who will not move up in line and will get theirs later than they should.
If others don't have any ethical problems with someone profiting by selling their place, that's cool. This is suppose to be a community. I wouldn't do that to my neighbors. I wouldn't scalp tickets for more than their face value. This happened Sunday when I bought tickets to the Kings vs. Houston game. Face value was $77.50. I was offered $100 for each my extra two tickets. I sold them for face value instead. During the game, the guy bought me a beer and brought it to my seat and thanked me for being fair to him.
I haven't seen a response yet about people listing EBay links here. Is that acceptable here?
As for buying cars for over stoker price? I think the sticker is simply the manufacture's suggested retail price, not a binding contract. I don't see the comparison. Man, so much emotions here. I am opposed to people scalping and I am the bad guy??? Ok, I am a bad person trying to stop really nice people from making money, so be it. That was the intent of the first post, which I have already said was wrong and even apologize for. Again, the intent was to get Robert not to let anyone play us against each other by selling their place in line, which appears to be in violation of Robert's contract. Again why is it that Robert, the gentleman who wrote the original contract, agrees with my analysis?
Too much emotions herein my opinion and not enough objective analysis. But, I did get a discussion of the issue; even though it does surprise me that the vast majority of you don't see the sellers as people preying off others within this community for a simple small profit. Sorry if I upset anyone, I am not here to ruin your day. But if I get you to at least look differently at the situation for a couple of minutes, that is ok too.
:)
Posted by: dswallow
quote:
Originally posted by dlott
I was just wanting to verify that the HR10-250 DirecTV HD DVR will be in your computer systems on 4/1/04. There will be approximately 200 units to be activated starting that date. I do not want go to activate my HR10-250 DirecTV HD DVR to be told that it is not in the computer. Thanks, if you will follow up on this it might save the CSR's and your customers a lot of grief.
It'd be helpful if they have it there, of course, but if you don't see it there and are activating online, there's little to worry about -- just pick another Hughes HD receiver from the list.
Posted by: JEbbesen
quote:
Originally posted by joegolf68
Simple, if the original contract were enforced, there will be three people who will not move up in line and will get theirs later than they should.
I still don't understand, if the contracts are enforced you stay the same in line. If they sell their positions, you stay the same in line. What am I missing?
Posted by: k2ue
quote:
Originally posted by dswallow
It'd be helpful if they have it there, of course, but if you don't see it there and are activating online, there's little to worry about -- just pick another Hughes HD receiver from the list.
Is that still true? My TS360 de-authorized after 30 days or so and it turned out it was because the person who entered it put in the wrong Model Number. All the agent did was select the right model and it flew again.
Posted by: GreyGhost00
quote:
Originally posted by joegolf68
Simple, if the original contract were enforced, there will be three people who will not move up in line and will get theirs later than they should.
They're not getting them any later than they would have to begin with. They are just missing the chance to get them EARLIER than they originally would have.
Yeah, I understand your assertion that three people would have moved up and gotten them a week sooner, but frankly they're getting them at the same point as if everyone would have stood pat.
Can't we talk about more pertinent things - like how to get the Window button on the remotes to actually do something?
Posted by: gseeg
quote:
Originally posted by dswallow
It'd be helpful if they have it there, of course, but if you don't see it there and are activating online, there's little to worry about -- just pick another Hughes HD receiver from the list.
Doug, will that activate the Tivo service as well? Or do you even have to do that anymore? I got my Series 1 DirecTivo way back when you had to activate the receiver, and then activate the Tivo service with Tivo themselves, so I'm sure things have changed since then.
Posted by: gem
Countdown Timer
For those of you who want a countdown for the first shipments.
http://www.lakesidevillas.com/html/TiVoCountdown.html
Another thing to help keep us busy while waiting for our units.
Posted by: Marco
quote:
Originally posted by joegolf68
if the original contract were enforced, there will be three people who will not move up in line and will get theirs later than they should.
"Should." Interesting. Seems to me you'd get your box at the same time you previously thought you were going to get your box.
quote:
Originally posted by JEbbesen
I still don't understand, if the contracts are enforced you stay the same in line. If they sell their positions, you stay the same in line. What am I missing?
I can't think of what you're missing, either.
Let's say for the purposes of argument that someone (we'll call him "Joe") is 201st in line. If someone were to disappear from in line in front of him, he'd move up to #200 and have his HR10-250 a week earlier. But I don't think you can characterize "failure to move up" as DAMAGES. Joe entered into a contract with VE to purchase the box. VE went above and beyond the call of duty to tell him exactly when he would be getting the box, which they were not contractually obligated to do. Joe would still be getting his box when he expected to get his box ... and contract damages are typically about restoring the parties to where they expected to be if the contract were fully performed.
I'm not sure what clause of the contract between VE and buyer is allegedly violated here. I know it says the deposit is non-refundable. That just means VE can give back the deposit (i.e., modify the contract) if it and the buyer both want to do so. (Duh, of course the buyer will consent to getting his deposit back.)
Is there something about non-transferability to another? Even if there is, if VE *agrees* to the modification of the contract, then there's no question of breach ... and in any case, Joe would not be a party to that deal.
If such a seller (let's call him "Dave"), instead of selling his place in line, merely took delivery of his HR10-250 and *then* sold it on eBay, Joe would be in the same place in line he is now. If Dave were selling his box on eBay **right now** (which he could do, as eBay allows pre-sale up to 30 days in advance), Joe would be in the same position he is in now.
If someone is of the opinion that re-selling something for more than you paid for it is unethical, then we have untold millions of unethical Americans among us, starting with the likes of Bill Gates and Donald Trump. If someone doesn't want to "scalp" something to profit from a friend, that's admirable, but is not compelled by any law I'm aware of (except of course state / municipal laws on ticket resale).
Posted by: leesweet
I thought the activation question was already answered.... why can't you go to the website, pick HNS-Unknown if this one's real modem number is not there, and that's it? I've activated boxes there many times, and as I posted elsewhere only talked to D* CSRs once to get a replacement card when an SD STB came with a bad card. (I don't expect this model to be on the web, either. )
Heck, I have a Sammie S-75 that wasn't on the web, but I picked S-60, and it's still fine. I don't think that description is anything more than that (perhaps the manufacturer has to match, and the HNS will).
Oh, wait, my bad, we want another topic to obsess on. Okay, let's go ahead! :D (Beats the lawsuit topic by a mile...)
Posted by: dswallow
quote:
Originally posted by gseeg
Doug, will that activate the Tivo service as well? Or do you even have to do that anymore? I got my Series 1 DirecTivo way back when you had to activate the receiver, and then activate the Tivo service with Tivo themselves, so I'm sure things have changed since then.
Well, I suppose that's a good question... time will tell. ;) But I'd suspect that if you don't already have TiVo service active on the account you're going to have to call anyway.
Posted by: dandrewk
quote:
Originally posted by joegolf68
As for buying cars for over stoker price? I think the sticker is simply the manufacture's suggested retail price, not a binding contract. I don't see the comparison. Man, so much emotions here. I am opposed to people scalping and I am the bad guy??? Ok, I am a bad person trying to stop really nice people from making money, so be it.
:)
You say that you are against scalping. Scalpers take something desirable and sell it for more than face value. Just HOW is that different from a car dealer jacking up the price of a desirable item and selling it for more than face value?
I think part of the problem folks have with what you say is when you bandy about terms like "unethical". Ethics are entirely relative to individuals, and any reference to being "unethical" is forcing your own values onto somebody else.
Also, it is an offensive term, and you have yet to justify using it other than your distaste for capitalism.
Posted by: madpoet
I guess by Page 138 we all need something to argue about :)
Posted by: drewba
I like cake. Especially white cake with lemon or raspberry filling. Mmm, cake. :D
Posted by: joegolf68
lol Car dealers have a business license and are in business selling cars. No diference? Ok. Unethical is offensive? Ok, I think scalping is offensive.
Is it ok to post Ebay links and sell things here? Just checking?
Have a great day and RELAX everybody! Dang.
Posted by: elstonhill
quote:
Originally posted by dswallow
Do you have a regular DirecTV HD receiver now? If you have guide data now on those locals, I'd say you have a good chance with TiVo. Are any Canadian stations actually broadcasting ATSC, though?
I've not heard of anyone talking about this particular issue before, though I have recently seen mention people in the US near Mexico do get some stations broadcasting in Mexico as part of their DirecTV locals, so there's at least a chance that they might have guide data for near-border Canadian OTA stations.
I don't think the current DirecTV Tivo provide OTA. There are probably quite a few US citizens living on the border who could use a guide that includes stations just across the border.
Posted by: grins
I don't know who made the typo over at DirecTV, but there must a Hughes HIRD-E8 in their list of approved models, 'cause I know my HIRD-E86 shows on their computers as an E8, and I saw a post somewhere in TC from someone else who was registered as an E8. As Doug said, they don't care what model it is as long as you pay for the services.
Posted by: Darin
I can't STAND white cake. May as well eat crisco and sugar.
Give me German Chocolate. Or Carrot Cake. Or pineapple upside down cake. Or even yellow cake with chocolate icing. But white? BLEHHHHH!
Posted by: dswallow
Order listing moved, for convenience, to http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-v...797#post1829797
Posted by: madpoet
Yumm, crisco and sugar....
-MP
Posted by: Darin
Why'd you switch to evens? Who'da thunk you had an aversion to 69?
Posted by: ratfacejt
Posted this awhile ago, but hasn't shown up in the list:
Time of Order: 1/23/2004 5:54:28 PM
Order Type: Email
Order ID: 13042
Posted by: mercurial
quote:
Originally posted by Darin
I can't STAND white cake. May as well eat crisco and sugar.
Give me German Chocolate. Or Carrot Cake. Or pineapple upside down cake. Or even yellow cake with chocolate icing. But white? BLEHHHHH!
Cake? Schmake!
quote:
I hate fish. I hate fish, but I think most of all I hate fresh fish, like trout I hate fresh trout. My least-hated, favorite fish would be sole. That way you don't have to see the eyes. Sole has no eyes
Ok... new game... Name that reference and on your honor, no Googling! :)
Posted by: Darin
I don't know it, but whoever it was sounds like me.
Posted by: Kevin L
quote:
Originally posted by gem
Countdown Timer
For those of you who want a countdown for the first shipments.
http://www.lakesidevillas.com/html/TiVoCountdown.html
Another thing to help keep us busy while waiting for our units.
WOW, we really all need to get some therapy:D
Posted by: herdfan
quote:
Originally posted by joegolf68
Ok, I think scalping is offensive.
Not to pick on Joe, but why is scalping bad? If it weren't for scalpers, I would have missed several NASCAR races at Bristol (I have season tickets now), I would not have seen "The Producers" (with Lane & Broderick), and there are several other events I would have never been able to see without the benefit of scalpers. So, Yes I am willing to pay extra because I was not in the right place at the right time to purchase tickets from the source. How much extra depends on how bad I want to see it.
If I were to decide today I want to go to the Final Four, the only way I know of to get tickets is from a scalper which is my cost for poor planning. If people weren't willing to pay the prices, scalpers would not have a market. They provide a service. If you don't like it, don't pay a premium. Look at it as paying extra for the service, not the ticket. You pay face value for the ticket, put pay a fee for them standing in the sun, rain or snow to deliver it to you outside the venue. Actually I usually use white collar scalpers called ticket brokers, but you get my point.
And I can guarantee if I don't get my pre-order filled, I will be hunting ebay and be willing to pay "extra" for one of these units.
Posted by: Kevin L
quote:
Originally posted by Darin
I can't STAND white cake. May as well eat crisco and sugar.
Give me German Chocolate. Or Carrot Cake. Or pineapple upside down cake. Or even yellow cake with chocolate icing. But white? BLEHHHHH!
Carrot Cake! Now you're talking!:up:
Posted by: joegolf68
herdfan
Fair enough, we agree to disagree, but have done so with pretty decent logic. The ticket sellers who are professionals, as you say, white collar, are an actual licensed business. For the guys out in the streets, they are pretty much just hustling strangers, which is cool, as you say, in its own way. Here, I thought it was a "COMMUNITY" and I saw it as distasteful that members here were profiting off other members. Obviously, I am in the minority on the issue, so be it, that's ok too. But no one has answered two of my questions>
1. Why did Robert agree with me?
2. Is it ok to sell here by placing EBay links?
herdfan, you have some very good points and I agree with your analysis, just on inside a place where everyone says WE are a community. I think I had a different view of what a real cyber community was about. Shame on me.
Joe :)
Posted by: dandrewk
quote:
Originally posted by joegolf68
herdfan
Fair enough, we agree to disagree, but have done so with pretty decent logic. The ticket sellers who are professionals, as you say, white collar, are an actual licensed business. For the guys out in the streets, they are pretty much just hustling strangers, which is cool, as you say, in its own way. Here, I thought it was a "COMMUNITY" and I saw it as distasteful that members here were profiting off other members. Obviously, I am in the minority on the issue, so be it, that's ok too. But no one has answered two of my questions>
1. Why did Robert agree with me?
2. Is it ok to sell here by placing EBay links?
herdfan, you have some very good points and I agree with your analysis, just on inside a place where everyone says WE are a community. I think I had a different view of what a real cyber community was about. Shame on me.
Joe :)
We can agree to disagree, but no matter how you slice it, every single business in your local community is out to profit on you. Just how is that distasteful? They all have business licences, as do many ticket organizations. How is a car dealership any different from Mr. Ticket? How is somebody selling tickets above face value (making a profit over cost) any different from IBM selling a computer (making a profit over cost)?
I can go to my local city hall and get a business license. It would cost me about $25. Does that give me permission to make a profit on items I sell? Is that all that is required?
If your problem is with using THIS forum to advertise their auctions, that is one thing. But your whole arguement seems to be anti-capitalism, and nothing more.
Profit exists. Supply and demand exists. The NEED for people to profit exists. If you don't like what or how they are selling, or how much they are selling it for, don't buy. You may find it personally distasteful, but in no way, shape or form, is it unethical.
Posted by: GreyGhost00
quote:
Originally posted by KML
Carrot Cake! Now you're talking!:up:
Mmmmm .....
Posted by: gseeg
joegolf68 seems to be getting a "community" confused with a family. I don't know a community in the world where people don't profit off of one another.
Posted by: Marco
quote:
Originally posted by joegolf68
But no one has answered two of my questions
1. Why did Robert agree with me?
2. Is it ok to sell here by placing EBay links?
(1) I have no idea, ask Robert. Businesses don't like to get sued, even for frivolous reasons ... perhaps he's just being super careful. Perhaps he agrees with you that selling one's place in line is unethical. Perhaps (insert your personal speculation here).
(2) I haven't read the rules carefully enough to know. It's probably "officially" not permitted but the mods haven't spotted it, or don't consider it important enough to intervene. I don't have a problem with it.
Now then -- you haven't answered any of MY points concerning why you (or I) are not damaged by somebody selling his line spot to another person. Fair is fair. Do you concede that you would not actually suffer legally compensable damage?
Posted by: Marco
quote:
Originally posted by gseeg
joegolf68 seems to be getting a "community" confused with a family. I don't know a community in the world where people don't profit off of one another.
Heh. I know some families that do that, too. :D
Posted by: richierich
What happens to this thread after the units are delivered around April 2, 2004? Do we then add our comments about this unit and our experiences/problems with it or will someone create a new thread "How's Your New HD Tivo Working?"
Posted by: RxMan
I am just a few spots from the bottom of the list. How long should I wait to get all of the paperwork done? I know he is going to be very busy. I just don't want to get missed. BTW, I have received nothing beyond the 1st email from VE.
Posted by: leesweet
That 'email' was an automated response from their website. I've not received anything else and don't expect anything else for a while (I'm just above you....). Robert said all the pre 3/18 orders would go out before 5/1 or so, and I doubt he will need/want the papers before 4/15, so there's a while to go.
I'd *think* he won't even touch the next piles until the first two or three weeks (first 350? 450? 600?) are out the door. Let's give him until 4/10 until those of us 'on the bottom' pester him! :D
Posted by: RxMan
Sounds good to me. :)
Posted by: RxMan
Anyone know how long someone has to be 'away' from DTV to be considered a new customer again?
Posted by: dr_mal
quote:
Originally posted by RxMan
Anyone know how long someone has to be 'away' from DTV to be considered a new customer again?
AFAIK, you can't ever be a new customer twice. If you have a new phone number and a new address, you'll likely slip through the cracks.
Posted by: MichaelK
use a different credit card too
Posted by: RxMan
hmmm...I figured someone who canceled 3 1/2 years ago would not be considered an existing customer.
Posted by: PJO1966
they can still get you by social security number
Posted by: leesweet
Computers are wonderful things.... :) I'd think (too) that they'd be an 'expiration' period, but from what I've heard at AVS, you need a different 'identity'.
I have heard of people using the spouse's name/SSN for a 'new' account since she/he can always claim it's the same address and the bum left with all the D* equipment and I want my own now! :D
(If there' s no 'spouse', that's a problem....)
Posted by: dswallow
quote:
Originally posted by RxMan
hmmm...I figured someone who canceled 3 1/2 years ago would not be considered an existing customer.
About as likely as someone who hasn't had sex for 3 1/2 years becoming a virgin again.
Just call DirecTV, tell them you used to be a customer and ask them what sort of deals they have to get you back into the fold.
Posted by: RxMan
What difference does being new or old actually make?
What are the advantages/disadvantages?
Posted by: dswallow
quote:
Originally posted by RxMan
What difference does being new or old actually make?
What are the advantages/disadvantages?
Primarily it's access to new customer equipment pricing.
Posted by: RxMan
OK. As long as I can turn on a HD-DTivo then all is well.
Posted by: patjoy
Doug, you may as well add me to the list.
order number: 12834
date: 1/19/2004 4:10:24 PM
Thanks,
Posted by: drewba
quote:
Originally posted by PJO1966
they can still get you by social security number
Except for the fact that DirecTV only requires a SSN if you don't have a credit card. I only give out my SSN when absolutely required.
Posted by: Kamakzie
When I signed up I gave them my SS#, call me naive I guess..... I didn't feel like using my credit card for a year to pay my bill.
Posted by: leesweet
I did the same... I'd rather control the bill on paper, than have them auto-charging me.
Posted by: drewba
Will they automatically bill the credit card if they have the number? I want to be billed monthly, but I don't want to give my SSN. They can have my credit card number as security if they wish.
Posted by: dave3
you can always dispute a credit card bill. I also agree to never use SS# unless absolutley necessary.
Just the idea of identity theft scares the crap out of me.
Heres to the FTC who arrested a guy yesterday in texas sending out those fake emails like "update your pay pal info by giving us all your info".
Posted by: leesweet
When I called to set things up (at activation time), they wanted a credit card number to auto-bill. I think a lot of people pay the bill late, and they have the usual problems with turn-offs and collections. If they can dump that to the CC company, it's their problem. It's better for them, also, of course, if you order a gazillion PPVs and get a large bill to dump it on the CC rather than you screaming at that large bill! :)
So, I said, no, I wanted a paper bill, and he wanted an SSN. No prob for me. I assumed they wanted to run the quickie credit check for 'billing purposes'.
I don't know if they will paper bill but keep a CC for backup if you don't pay the paper on schedule.
Posted by: leesweet
quote:
Originally posted by dave3
Heres to the FTC who arrested a guy yesterday in texas sending out those fake emails like "update your pay pal info by giving us all your info".
Oh, definitely. People who do phishing emails should be shot, drawn, quartered, and *then* boiled in old. The more people get into the Internet, the more people are going to be burned by this sort of thing (since the fake sites look so good).
I'm a security guy at our company, and I've been over all this sort of thing with my wife. and even she asked me why she got one: "I don't use eBay". I said, it's just spam, but think: "What if you *did* use eBay? And didn't have a clue?"
Posted by: sotapoppy
Since this thread seems to be all inclusive ;) I thought I'd ask -
Is anyone else still getting emails referring to the w32.netsky virus? I remember reading about some of these awhile back (maybe in this thread).
I'm getting 1 or 2 of these per day. Yahoo seems to catch them ok.
Posted by: TreoFred
quote:
Originally posted by leesweet
I'm a security guy at our company, and I've been over all this sort of thing with my wife. and even she asked me why she got one: "I don't use eBay". I said, it's just spam, but think: "What if you *did* use eBay? And didn't have a clue?"
Agreed! I received those email from Ebay, Paypal and even Citibank (pointing to a machine in Russia... which, as everybody know, is where citibank originates ALL of its email (with typos !) requesting me to update my Credit Card info...)
Nasty ones too are those viruses, which are getting cleverer by the minute in masquerading as legitimate email to get you to open: there's one around pretending to be administrator@mywebsite that warns of a new virus (sic !) and asks people to update their antivirus signature file by using the attachement... Now that's cunning! Of course, I AM Administrator so I don't find that really funny...
Anyway, back to the pre-order frenzy. I just called VE to see if I could get my place in line: no love. They said, as they probably did a bazillion times before, that if they didn't send any email after receiving my fax, that means that everything was ok and I should receive it no later than the day it gets delivered to me. Ok, I made that last part up but no info on my ranking that I personally estimate in the high 600, solely based on the New Tables of the Law that Doug's list has become.
Posted by: dave3
I would think that the scum who are phishing for SS#'s and credit card info are getting millions of responses to thier emails. The emails are usually well planned out and look pretty real. The only way to know its fake is to see how the url ends.
Posted by: Kamakzie
Really DirecTV isn't who would use your SS# for bad things. It would be a rogue CSR but I would think the odds of that would be slim.
Posted by: dswallow
Order listing moved, for convenience, to http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-v...229#post1831229
Posted by: dswallow
quote:
Originally posted by Darin
Why'd you switch to evens? Who'da thunk you had an aversion to 69?
No aversion here... come visit if you don't believe me... :p
...anyway...
It's on page 69 now; somebody deleted a post somewhere. I hate that.
There were about 10 more posts left on page 68 before it rolled over, I left for the office, and when I got there page 69 was more than half full already, so I figured I'd wait till page 70 at that point. I was then just going to let 3 pages go by but now that it's back on page 69, I decided to do it on page 71 again.
Posted by: Kamakzie
Thanks for engraving that image in my brain Doug! :o :)
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