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Enterprise rumors: your hopes fulfilled? Or the end?
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Posted by: Big_Daddy

Rumors are abounding for this much-maligned sad cousin to Star Trek. Discuss!

http://www.cinescape.com/0/editoria...55&obj_id=40707

Posted by: jones07

FUD ! :)

But god I love reading insiders stuff like this. :p

I think 9 PM is a better timeslot anyway (beginning in March)

Thanks for the post

Posted by: GameGuru

I actually enjoy Enterprise, I liked Voyager also. Maybe I am weird.

Posted by: jones07

DS9 was the only TREK that I never watched regularly. That could have something to do with me having 4 small kids two jobs and no ReplayTV back then. My DVR til this very day still finds DS9 episodes I never seen.
That shows how many weeks I just forgot to watch or set my "VCR" for. :p

Posted by: Big_Daddy

I still think they should abandon Enterprise and give Farscape a shot - with Enterprise's budget. But I am a true Farscape geek.

Posted by: jhausmann

quote:
Originally posted by Big_Daddy
Rumors are abounding for this much-maligned sad cousin to Star Trek. Discuss!

http://www.cinescape.com/0/editoria...55&obj_id=40707

Berman's departure from ST will be one of the 2 best things for the franchise (the other being the departure of Braga)....

Posted by: net114

quote:
Originally posted by jhausmann
Berman's departure from ST will be one of the 2 best things for the franchise (the other being the departure of Braga)....

I agree...but not because I have anything against either one. They were both instrumental in making some great episodes of other Trek series, and for the TNG movie "First Contact"...one of my favorites. So, I don't put all the blame with the failing ratings of everything with them. (Maybe 60/40?).

Regardless - it is time for a change to shake everything up. They need someone with bold ideas to come in fresh. Heck, maybe let Burton or Frakes take a shot at it...they have directed and done outstanding work...maybe they could take the helm with a better read on what Trek fans really want to see.

Posted by: drew2k

quote:
Originally posted by net114
I agree...but not because I have anything against either one. They were both instrumental in making some great episodes of other Trek series, and for the TNG movie "First Contact"...one of my favorites. So, I don't put all the blame with the failing ratings of everything with them. (Maybe 60/40?).

Regardless - it is time for a change to shake everything up. They need someone with bold ideas to come in fresh. Heck, maybe let Burton or Frakes take a shot at it...they have directed and done outstanding work...maybe they could take the helm with a better read on what Trek fans really want to see.

Frakes was behind the scenes on "Roswell" and I thought it was an outstanding show when it debuted. I don't know how involved he was after season one, but that show took a major detour in season 2 and in my opinion never recovered. However, based on his work on First Contact and Roswell, I wouldn't object if he took over for a bit on ST:Enterprise ...

Posted by: Bryanmc

I would wet my pants if Frakes came in.

I love him so much and have such respect for his work (more from behind the camera).

I think he would kick serious butt as a producer of this show.

He is by far my favorite person to be affiliated with Star Trek (though not my favorite character).

Posted by: Peter000

I wish they'd change the night of Enterprise as well as the time. Wednesday is a tough slot to compete in... what with Angel and West Wing (at 9:00). Tuesday would be good for me. :)

Posted by: LoadStar

quote:
Originally posted by GameGuru
I actually enjoy Enterprise, I liked Voyager also. Maybe I am weird.

I watched Voyager on a regular basis, but wasn't all that fond of it - it wasn't a bad series, it just wasn't the great series that DS9 was.

Going back and watching the series in syndication was pretty interesting, as there were some really good episodes mixed in with the lackluster ones... and the series as a whole was better than it got credit for. Still not a GREAT series, just better than it was made out to be.

Enterprise, however... I eventually stopped watching, mostly because of an overriding sense of disappointment. They could've done so much more with the series and didn't. People criticized the characters on Voyager as being cardboard cutouts... but Enterprise's characters are even flatter, no texture or substance to them. Many plots are obvious rehashes of ones they've done before - and better. Additionally, the continuous middle finger to continuity just got too frustrating to take.

The series has so much wrong at this point, that I don't think even a change of management could help. They need to stop... take a break... then start over with something better than Enterprise.

Posted by: net114

quote:
Originally posted by Bryanmc
I would wet my pants if Frakes came in.

I love him so much and have such respect for his work (more from behind the camera).

I think he would kick serious butt as a producer of this show.

He is by far my favorite person to be affiliated with Star Trek (though not my favorite character).

I'm right there with you...Frakes is one of the most, if not the most talented person who has been involved with Trek. He was very involved with Roswell Season One, but I heard he was not involved beyond consulting after that. I heard from both net rumor, and from him in promo interviews(with tact) that there was a LOT of talk on the set of Nemesis by him trying to tell the director things like "our characters really would not do this or that...". Meaning, that he was very aware of their history and seems to want that conveyed on screen.

By the way, the answer was (this almost a direct quote) "We don't care about what happened before, we want this movie to stand on its own."

And we know the result....

Posted by: zync

quote:
I think 9 PM is a better timeslot anyway (beginning in March)

Right, because being up against TWW and Angel always does a show good in our household.

Anyway - more the reason to catch it on the Saturday repeat.

Posted by: Frylock

Frakes would be a brilliant move for the show. Star Trek fans would tune in just to see what he did, and he would lend some credibility to the show, as long as he doesn't try and put himself in the show, as you know William Shatner would.

And bring Burton along. The combo of the two would bring something fresh and exciting to the series.

Posted by: whitson77

quote:
Originally posted by Bryanmc
I would wet my pants if Frakes came in.

I love him so much and have such respect for his work (more from behind the camera).

Ahhhhhhhhhhh!!!!

Posted by: DougF

I'm open to what some new talent can do, but I'm not in the "hate B&B" camp. I enjoyed the first two years, but they are admittedly not as good as the best years of the other series.

I'm still a few episodes behind, but two of the last three I have watched ("Twilight" and "Similitude") are easily in the top 10-20 of all Trek episodes I have seen, and I haven't missed many. I think I'd even put "Similitude" in the top five. The show is really good right now. I'm not so sure that now is the time to shake things up.

Posted by: Frank_M

I still say that Enterprise's problems stem almost wholely from the concept. By doing a "prequel"... you remove most/all of the potential drama in the series.

Yes, it is interesting to see how the relationship with the Klingons developed. But otherwise, we're watching a story of which we know the end. Anyone new introduced, if we'd never heard of them in ST lore, is by definition not important.

It's the same issue I have with the Star Wars prequels. While we all watch them with interest, we're simply less invested in them.

I think it's either time for the Starfleet Academy series, or to skip forward another 100 years to the "next" Next Generation.

Posted by: drew2k

quote:
Originally posted by whitson77
quote:
Originally posted by Bryanmc
I would wet my pants if Frakes came in.

I love him so much and have such respect for his work (more from behind the camera).
Ahhhhhhhhhhh!!!!

Do you need a towel? :)

I stopped watching in the middle of Season 2, but have still been recording every episode since then. I stopped watching after an episode where Archer spent the entire episode in sick bay with his sick dog while the doctor ran around with a butterfly net. This was the final straw for me in terms of being patient, as I could not believe that I had wasted an hour of my life on this dreck. I just couldn't watch another episode after that, but as a fan of the brand, I kept recording anyway.

It's now been about a year, and I'm still not ready to watch the "lost" episodes. However, knowing some changes might be coming behind the scenes could very well propel me to watch again. Ever hopeful ...

Posted by: DougF

quote:
I stopped watching in the middle of Season 2, but have still been recording every episode since then.

If you don't watch any of the rest, be sure and catch "Similitude" from the current season. It packs an emotional wallop in the grand tradtion of TNG's "The Inner Light" and DS9's "The Visitor". While it does have a few elements of the Xindi arc from this year, it make a fine standalone ep.

quote:
I could not believe that I had wasted an hour of my life on this dreck.

But as TiVo users, we only wasted about 40 minutes, right? :)

Posted by: jhausmann

Interesting item:

http://www.scifi.com/scifiwire/art-...-02/13/10.20.tv

I think they're trying to gauge just how upset the fan base will be if they cut the show. At this point in time, it seems like there will be significantly less concern than when TOS was taken off the air. IOW, it'll probably go out in a whimper

Posted by: coldtoes

I continued watching through the first two seasons despite pretty much hating the show, but this season I actually think it's gotten good. It's just too bad it took them this long. If it weren't for TiVo's SP system (where you actively have to cancel the show, and if you're lazy it just keeps showing up and you just keep watching it :) ) I, too, would have given up long ago.

Having someone who cared more about timeline and character continuity would definitely solve some of the show's problems. If they use the "temporal time war" plotline smartly (to have exciting events occur that later can be undone) rather than stupidly (to make things happen that you know from watching later Treks should never actually have happened) then that solves some of the prequel problem Frank_M brought up.

But moving it against Angel does not seem smart. It is definitely my third priority after Angel and West Wing, and I only have two TiVos, so if they didn't rerun it on Saturdays here, it would be off my list.

Posted by: whitson77

I hope they don't cancel it. It just got interesting to me.

Posted by: brenrher

I enjoy it. The secret to me though, is that it's important to remember it is a prequel. By extrapolation, the things and sequences and special effects we saw in later series should not be the standard of expectation. I'll grant the storyline has been weak on occason, but then, there were those times all the other series had similar peaks and valleys. I hope it continues.

Posted by: net114

quote:
Originally posted by jhausmann
Interesting item:

http://www.scifi.com/scifiwire/art-...-02/13/10.20.tv

I think they're trying to gauge just how upset the fan base will be if they cut the show. At this point in time, it seems like there will be significantly less concern than when TOS was taken off the air. IOW, it'll probably go out in a whimper

Friday nights?! That's too funny. Since "All In The Family", everyone knows that is how networks kill shows. The ratings go WAY down because no one is home on Friday nights, so the network has a "we had no choice" position. I don't think there are enough Tivos to save it if they do that.

The real problem will be what is next? It may be years before we see a new Trek movie or show if they cancel Enterprise now. Don't cancel the show, FIRE THE CURRENT MANAGEMENT.

Posted by: martinp13

quote:
Originally posted by drew2k
I stopped watching in the middle of Season 2, but have still been recording every episode since then. I stopped watching after an episode where Archer spent the entire episode in sick bay with his sick dog while the doctor ran around with a butterfly net. This was the final straw for me in terms of being patient, as I could not believe that I had wasted an hour of my life on this dreck. I just couldn't watch another episode after that, but as a fan of the brand, I kept recording anyway.

I got thru a couple more episodes than you did, but til yesterday I had every episode from Apr 2003 on hanging around on the TiVo. I finally decided I had to get them off the TiVo, so I marathoned... after a couple of tearjerker episodes, they went back to more action, and a bit more intelligence. It was like someone had flipped a switch, which I guess is when they decided to do the Xindi story arc. If you can get past the Borg episode (I had to hide the remote and tie myself to the chair... urg!), the Xindi stuff is so far pretty cool (my next episode is Extinction). From what I've seen so far, they've done what B5 seemed unable to do in story-arc land: actually make the non-arc "filler" shows fit in with the arc shows.

Only 13 more episodes and I'm caught up! :)

Posted by: Vesper

The last several episodes seem to have been better than those previous in the season. I noticed in the credits that Manny Coto (creator of Odyssey 5) has been doing both writing and producing for Enterprise lately. He's a talented guy, if O5 is any indication, and I hope they let him continue to help out Enterprise.

Posted by: KLB

No offense to anyone who likes the show but I'm praying they kill it.

From what I've heard berman and braga have a lock-solid contract with paramount and if they get fired paramount has to pay them PILES of cash except in situations where there are ratings failures and such.

My dream would be for them to kill the show. Fire berman and braga and after whatever period of time they need to wait re-up the cast and put "the franchise" under the wing of someone like Coto or someone else who is some fresh blood and doesn't hate ST and the fans.

Posted by: jones07

quote:
Originally posted by KLB
No offense to anyone who likes the show but I'm praying they kill it.
.

Blasphemer. :p

Why don't you just stop watching the show and let us folks that enjoy it.......Enjoy it ? ;)

Posted by: jhausmann

quote:
Originally posted by jones07
Blasphemer. :p

Why don't you just stop watching the show and let us folks that enjoy it.......Enjoy it ? ;)

The 4 or 5 of you that do ought to get together to watch it, it'll help lessen our dependence on foreign oil....;)

Posted by: edc

quote:
Originally posted by KLB
My dream would be for them to kill the show. Fire berman and braga and after whatever period of time they need to wait re-up the cast and put "the franchise" under the wing of someone like Coto or someone else who is some fresh blood and doesn't hate ST and the fans.

Dream on...

If ST:Enterprise goes down, the Trek franchise is dead for probably ten years on TV or film. Look at "Doctor Who," which was a comparable UK franchise. Despite a license to print money via ongoing merchandise and overseas sales, the series has been idle for nearly twenty years, and the return is only guaranteed a single season...

Posted by: mitchb2

I haven't watched any episodes from this season yet, other than the opener.

My friend told me there are more episodes this season where everything is magically cured/resolved in the final couple of minutes of the show, with a cheesy bail-out.

I hate when they do that...like the episode where Hoshi was a "ghost."

POOF! It was all a dream.

Posted by: drew2k

:mad: Well, mitch - you just spoiled an episode for me regarding Hoshi. I hope by the time I catch up to that episode, I will have forgotten all about your spoiler. But now every time I see Hoshi I'll probably be regarding her with suspicion wondering if "this is the one" ...

Please use spoiler tags, especially for something that's revealed in the last few minutes, per your own gripe!

Posted by: bobcarn

I've been really enjoying this season. I thought there were some pretty clever episodes. It's definitely working out well (finally).

Posted by: TivownerSrsII

I've always felt that they needed to give the star trek franchise a break. Give it a rest for a couple of years maybe (or even 5) and then pick up again with a new series. Hopefully they will make the Starfleet Academy series... but with this new MACO addition I have a feeling they are leaning towards a more militaristic trek...

Posted by: JYoung

quote:
Originally posted by edc

If ST:Enterprise goes down, the Trek franchise is dead for probably ten years on TV or film. Look at "Doctor Who," which was a comparable UK franchise. Despite a license to print money via ongoing merchandise and overseas sales, the series has been idle for nearly twenty years, and the return is only guaranteed a single season...

Unfortunately, this is probably an accurate assessment.
With the tanking of Nemesis and the lackluster ratings and reception to Enterprise, it seems that Viacom is giving the franchise a hard look in terms of profitability.
Of course, TPTB will blame the fans, saying that they aren't interested in Star Trek anymore instead of apologizing for spewing out crap.

I suspect that the current sweeps period will be the key in determining Enterprise's future.

Posted by: net114

quote:
Originally posted by TivownerSrsII
I've always felt that they needed to give the star trek franchise a break. Give it a rest for a couple of years maybe (or even 5) and then pick up again with a new series. Hopefully they will make the Starfleet Academy series... but with this new MACO addition I have a feeling they are leaning towards a more militaristic trek...

This can lead to nothing but an open door to Trek not being around for a decade or more. It has NOTHING to do with needing a "break". For longer than Trek, the Bond films used the same spy formula over and over-- and consistently get good earnings, great video games, etc etc...

...here comes the cliche: If you build it, they will come! If you make a good product, the audience will come! They have the whole freakin' galaxy to use, the last thing they need is a break. What they DO need to do is present good material to the audience. If it is exciting and written well, if it MOVES people...they will watch.

Posted by: TIVOFREAK

I agree this season has been the best by far. I have actually started to look forward to it each week. The first two seasons were very bad and this comes from a guy who has attended a few conventions.

Posted by: KLB

quote:
Originally posted by jones07
Blasphemer. :p

Why don't you just stop watching the show and let us folks that enjoy it.......Enjoy it ? ;)

Actually, I gave up on the show a long while back--- but I do have often and fond thoughts about decon gel. <pause for moment of reflection>

I wouldn't bet that if E goes belly up it's the end of ST on the tube, don't ever forget that the majority of income coming through the tills at Paramount is coming from the ST Franchise and they would be loath to stop kicking that dead horse.

Personally, I am a major Star Trek fan and my desire or hope to see Enterprise die has nothing to do with the show, the cast, the storyline but with the fact that berman and braga pre-ruined it like they did with VOY.

I've heard tons of personal stories from people who worked on the shows over the years and these money grubbing morons need to go and be done with it.

bring in some new blood and make it someone who loves and respects Star Trek and wants to make as good as it can be rather then see how many episodes they can slap their names on so they get paid a writing fee, see if they can put a song that none of them like as the theme song but do it to annoy the fans, see how many elements of continuity they can ignore in the ST universe because it annoys them that the fans pay attention to that sort of thing.

Time for them to go.

I'll say one last thing though: Decon Gel. (sigh)