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Airline 2/23 SPOILERS!!
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Posted by: David Platt
"I'm an American citizen. I have the right to be on that plane."
:D :D Which amendment to the constitution was that?
Posted by: daperlman
quote:
Originally posted by David Platt
"I'm an American citizen. I have the right to be on that plane."
:D :D Which amendment to the constitution was that?
To make matters worse, if the plane didn't kill that lady, the trip would have. They were dragging her to Las Vegas so see could suck down booze and cigarette smoke.
Now the 10 year old saying: "I am going to get an attorney and sue SWA" is a sad commentary on today's society.
On another note, the Muslim family whose medicine made it on a plane (unlike the person who needed it to survive):
That was truly unbelievable to me. What the hell is wrong with that woman who said she couldn't authorize buying another ticket at first. The sick woman had proven she needed the pills to live! I cannot imagine the amount of liability that SWA is exposed to if that woman would have suffered death or even a worsened condition.
At the very least if I was a SWA agent I would have immediately called her doc and had the prescription delivered to a nearby Pharmacy at SWA expense.
Posted by: Gunnyman2k3
I NEVER check my bag with medication in it.
Meds go in the Carry on. I thought that was common sense.
Posted by: mp2526
quote:
Originally posted by Gunnyman2k3
I thought that was common sense.
You would think it was.
Posted by: LoadStar
You got it. Anything you literally cannot live without (medication/medical supplies), anything you cannot replace, that sort of thing - bring that with you as carryon. Checked baggage is for clothing and stuff that could be replaced or done without.
Posted by: daperlman
Common sense or not... they could sue and there is a chance they'd win. Let alone the inconvenience of SWA making them wait 1 hour for a wheelchair while the flight is leaving! I am just shocked the supervisor would have considered taking that kind of chance.
Posted by: nmiller855
I take only enough medicine for the amount of days I will be travelling plus a 2 days extra, just in case, and a change of clothes in a carry on bag. The last time I travelled, I saw other people taking huge bags on the plane instead of checking them so when it was time for the last few of us to board, we were told we had to check our carry ons even though they were small enough to fit in the boxes designated for size. If I hadn't been heading home where my medication was, I would have insisted they find room for my small bag even if it meant someone else checking an over-sized bag in order to keep my medicine with me.
Posted by: mp2526
quote:
Originally posted by nmiller855
I would have insisted they find room for my small bag even if it meant someone else checking an over-sized bag in order to keep my medicine with me.
They will never make you check a bag that will fit under the seat in front of you, so I would always put anything I absolutely needed in that bag.
Posted by: jsmeeker
SW is pretty tight when it comes to cases like the bag then went out without the PAX (and I thought that violated security regulations). They were in L.A. right? And the destination was New York, IIRC..
What time of the day was it? It seemed to be Southwest's last flight of he day to New York.. I think it's pretty clear that SW was the one responsible for the lady missing her flight.. But what they do to make up for it was very, very weak.. One solution was to get the passenger to NY on another carrier. But, as the agent said, they don't have interline agreements with other airlines. (Other airlines do have interline agreements between themelves..). And they balked at buying her a ticket on another carrier.. Another solution that occurred to me was to get the bag when it arrived in NY, and have it shipped back to LA on the first availalbe flight on any carrier back to LAX. (not sure if this would have been faster, becasue I don't know what time of the day it was when this happened).
Posted by: newsposter
quote:
Originally posted by jsmeeker
SW is pretty tight when it comes to cases like the bag then went out without the PAX (and I thought that violated security regulations).
That's the 1st thing I thought when it happened. So much for 1000 quadrillon on security this year.
Posted by: jsmeeker
quote:
Originally posted by newsposter
That's the 1st thing I thought when it happened. So much for 1000 quadrillon on security this year.
IIRC, bag mathching is what the airlines wanted as opposed to actual searches or scans of every bag. Honestly, I thought bag matching was part of the newest security rules.. When I fly AA, I hear announcements for other flights where they call for people who checked in but haven't boarded.. It's usually followed by the warning that their bags will be removed from the flight.
Posted by: llurgy
quote:
Originally posted by daperlman
To make matters worse, if the plane didn't kill that lady, the trip would have. They were dragging her to Las Vegas so see could suck down booze and cigarette smoke.
I thought they said at the beginning of the show that Grandma was originally on Vacation in Chigago, she took ill whilst there and that they were now trying to get her home to Vegas.
Mandy
Posted by: daperlman
quote:
Originally posted by llurgy
I thought they said at the beginning of the show that Grandma was originally on Vacation in Chigago, she took ill whilst there and that they were now trying to get her home to Vegas.
Mandy
I thought it was a vacation for her 85th b-day... doesn't say on AandE.com...
Posted by: jsmeeker
I thought it was a vacation too.. Hte grandson was upset about it, saying how he had been looking forward to it for a long time.
Posted by: Todd
The grandma was on vacation in Chicago where she got sick and had to have surgery. They were trying to get her back home to Vegas.
BTW, is it illegal to fly with O2 tanks or just a SW regulation? Do all airlines prevent them from flying?
I love this show though. I've tried to get other people to watch it, but they think I'm nuts. "WHY would anyone want to watch what goes on in an airport??" :rolleyes:
Posted by: newsposter
I think the O2 was covered in another airline thread but I'm too lazy to look for it
Posted by: IJustLikeTivo
quote:
Originally posted by jsmeeker
IIRC, bag mathching is what the airlines wanted as opposed to actual searches or scans of every bag. Honestly, I thought bag matching was part of the newest security rules.. When I fly AA, I hear announcements for other flights where they call for people who checked in but haven't boarded.. It's usually followed by the warning that their bags will be removed from the flight.
I thought that bag matching was the least they were allowed to do. I would not be surprised to hear that SWA got a call from TSA tomorrow.
Posted by: IJustLikeTivo
quote:
Originally posted by newsposter
I think the O2 was covered in another airline thread but I'm too lazy to look for it
Yep, SWA has the same policy most do. You can take oxygen only if you arrange in advance as they will not let you take your own. The will get if for you if needed and charge you for the costs. Same thing happened a couple episodes back with a older Japanese man and his wife. He was going to try and do without but got nervous and asked to get off, leaving his wife the go ahead without him.
Posted by: pantherman007
quote:
Originally posted by IJustLikeTivo
I thought that bag matching was the least they were allowed to do. I would not be surprised to hear that SWA got a call from TSA tomorrow.
There's a choice. All the checked baggage either has to be positively matched to a boarded passenger or run through the scanning equipment. The scanners are large, slow, and expensive, and most carriers only install them in airports where they have a major presence and use the bag match process in the remaining airports.
I didn't see the episode, but I'm surprised this wasn't commented on to avoid exactly these kind of questions. It's not like the flying public needs any more reasons to be skeptical or concerned these days ...
Posted by: FatherTed
quote:
Originally posted by newsposter
I think the O2 was covered in another airline thread but I'm too lazy to look for it
Yes, there was another thread on oxygen. If you want to read Southwest's rules on oxygen just go to their site and put oxygen in the search box on the front page. No oxygen premitted in flight unless an in-flight emergency has occured.
Ok, let's create a chain of evidenice since the show didn't spell it out. We know granny was visiting these wonderful human beings in Chicago, fell ill, and needed surgery. That was clearly defined. Heinous woman already stated that they signed her out of the hospital AMA (Against Medical Advice). So, the doctor sure as hell didn't want her going anywhere let alone on a plane.
Now, the question comes about the Las Vegas issue and who belonged where. My wife just popped out a titbit I had overlooked. They were ALL going on vacation in Las Vegas including granny. How do we know this? When they struck out with the Chicago doctor 'heinous woman' decided to try granny's own physician when she was shot down mid-call. Where was this doctor? Boston She's from freaking Boston. So 'heinous woman' yanks granny out of the hospital AMA so they can all continue on with their intended vacation in Vegas. She was so adamant that they all get on that plane because' we've been planning this for months.' So she cares so much about granny that she pull her out of the hospital so as not to screw up their vacation plans. :rolleyes:
And we know the whole compassion for granny is there when she was going to leave her butt in the airport (hey, she's not my problem. You won't let her board so you figure out how to get her wherever.)
As for the lost medication people. Firstly, all the packing instructions for airlines always tell people never to pack any medication necessary for the health and wellbeing of the passenger. But, let's dissect this one too...
They checked her medication and she gets separated from her medication. What would have happened if they would have arrived and discovered the bag was lost? They would have called the physician for a replacement presecription. Simple. How is this any different. Call the doctor and tell them the situation and have them call in a prescription. Get on the plane and upon arrival go to the pharmacy. She wouldn't have had any access to the medication on the plane anyhow so, unless she needs to down it at the airport (kind of doubtful since they checked it in luggage) go pick up the damn medication and shut up. :rolleyes:
Posted by: Martyp
Well we have flown SWA between Oakland and Vegas and can not tell you how many times our bags have got to vegas or oakland long before us. I would say that it has happened almost every time we fly made me change to Aloha Airlines. Hate to think how many bags are on the jet that I am on with SWA that a person who owns it is not on that flight.
Posted by: faerie
I didn't understand the whole medicine thing either, for the same reasons other people have pointed out.
1) if the drugs were truly needed due to a life threatening situation, they should not have gone into the bag that was checked, they should have been right next to her.
2) once they discovered the problem, they COULD have just called the doc and had the doc call the nearest pharmacy to get her the pills she needs until she can be matched up with her bag again.
3) SWA doesn't book people on other airlines, it's part of their policy. I applaud them for pulling through in this situation, I think they did the right thing, but according to their rules, they didn't have to do that.
4) I too thought about how did that bag get on that flight and leave without the passenger it belonged to? I thought for sure that it was one of the new airline regulations that made it that much safer to fly. If what we've heard earlier in this thread is true, perhaps they ran that bag through a scanner so they would be exempt but I would hope that someone would be checking into this to see if that is indeed the case.
Posted by: bicker
quote:
Originally posted by daperlman
Now the 10 year old saying: "I am going to get an attorney and sue SWA" is a sad commentary on today's society.
That and, "We've been waiting a whole month -- uh -- I mean a whole week..."
Where does a young child like that learn to lie like that? Wonder of wonders.
quote:
On another note, the Muslim family whose medicine made it on a plane (unlike the person who needed it to survive):
That was truly unbelievable to me. What the hell is wrong with that woman who said she couldn't authorize buying another ticket at first.
It is called responsibility. You don't spend a company's money for things you're not authorized to.quote:
The sick woman had proven she needed the pills to live! I cannot imagine the amount of liability that SWA is exposed to if that woman would have suffered death or even a worsened condition.
None. The CoC makes it 100% crystal clear that it is the passenger's responsibility to ensure they have essential medication on their person. It's utterly idiotic to put essential medication in checked luggage. What WERE they thinking?quote:
At the very least if I was a SWA agent I would have immediately called her doc and had the prescription delivered to a nearby Pharmacy at SWA expense.
That sounds very reasonable. I don't get the impression that there was any room allowed by the daughter for a discussion in that direction.
In the end, Southwest went the extra mile for this passenger. They should be recognized for that.
Posted by: bicker
quote:
Originally posted by Todd
BTW, is it illegal to fly with O2 tanks or just a SW regulation? Do all airlines prevent them from flying?
It is a Southwest regulation. They're perfectly within their rights to impose that regulation, since accommodating such passengers is not covered by ADA on two counts, not just one (airline and financial hardship).
Posted by: bicker
quote:
Originally posted by IJustLikeTivo
Yep, SWA has the same policy most do. You can take oxygen only if you arrange in advance as they will not let you take your own.
I believe you're mistaken. Southwest's recommendation if you need oxygen is to fly a higher-priced airline.
Posted by: FatherTed
Oh, I just realized I forgot to whine about the guy who lost his ticket. What a jerk! It's Southwest's fault he lost the ticket? (Kind of reminded me of the guy last week who tried to fake the boarding pass for the flight.) The poor daughter was so embarrased that he's ranting and raving over his own incompetence.
I loved that attitude too when the counter agent was explaining that if he found it he can return it to them for a refund and he replies, "Oh, I think we both know that's not going to happen" like she was conspiring against him or something.
Posted by: jlb.x
Positive bag check (making sure you and your luggage are on the same flight) was an interim security measure put in place before all airports were equipped with screening equipment and TSA agents to fondle your checked luggage.
So, now that all luggage is screened, airlines are (once again) free to put anyone's luggage on any flight to, basically, anywhere. So long as it's at your final destination when you get there.
Granny and "henious woman" (not to mention Dad-jerk) should be glad they were flying an airline that has liberal refund, reuse, and repurchase allowances. The value of Granny's ticket will be good for another flight with no penalty and they are nice enough to rebook "henious woman" and son on the next day's flights (presumably) without penalty. Nine out of 10 other airlines would charge them each $100, plus the difference in the fares.
Dad-jerk should be glad he doesn't have to pay a walk-up fare on another major airline ($500 each would not be out of the question) and that, if he finds the lost tickets stashed away in his crack-pipe shoebox, he can send them in for a refund.
Posted by: Todd
quote:
Originally posted by FatherTed
Oh, I just realized I forgot to whine about the guy who lost his ticket. What a jerk! It's Southwest's fault he lost the ticket? (Kind of reminded me of the guy last week who tried to fake the boarding pass for the flight.) The poor daughter was so embarrased that he's ranting and raving over his own incompetence.
Does SW not use e-tickets??
Posted by: bigpuma
quote:
Originally posted by Todd
Does SW not use e-tickets??
They definately have e-tickets but you can also purchase paper tickets. I don't understand why anyone would buy a paper ticket but you have that option. I am flying in April on SWA with an e-ticket so I don't have to worry about losing it.
Posted by: pmyers
What a great show! I got into this show late and only because you all kept raving about it ;) I love the show but my wife can't understand why I watch a show about airports.....I just love how stupid most of the people are what they think are their "rights".
Posted by: whoknows55
Why don't i ever see this kind of stuff when i'm at the airport? ;)
Posted by: newsposter
quote:
Originally posted by whoknows55
Why don't i ever see this kind of stuff when i'm at the airport? ;)
Because you are 2 hours early, have your ID, your paper ticket, no wheelchair, no oxygen, aren't drunk and don't have rowdy traveling partners.
Posted by: daperlman
quote:
Originally posted by David Platt
"I'm an American citizen. I have the right to be on that plane."
:D :D Which amendment to the constitution was that?
It is not an amendment silly. It is part of the Patriot Act!
:D
Posted by: Todd
quote:
Originally posted by bigpuma
They definately have e-tickets but you can also purchase paper tickets. I don't understand why anyone would buy a paper ticket but you have that option. I am flying in April on SWA with an e-ticket so I don't have to worry about losing it.
Do they not still have all of your information in their computers so that they could get you on anyway?
Posted by: bigpuma
quote:
Originally posted by Todd
Do they not still have all of your information in their computers so that they could get you on anyway?
You would think so, I have always used e-tickets since they have become available so I don't know. I have seen this on other airlines as well that say the paper ticket is the same as cash and make sure you don't lose it.
Posted by: mp2526
quote:
Originally posted by Todd
Do they not still have all of your information in their computers so that they could get you on anyway?
Yes, but with a un accounted for paper ticket out there, they are just covering themselves, if someone should try to use that paper ticket. With all the new security regs, it's less likely to happen, but there rules are still in place to prevent it.
Posted by: pmyers
I would assume them charging if you loose your ticket is because it cost them time/money to issue you a new ticket as well as make sure that nobody else uses the ticket you just lost rather them not actually being able to just print you up a new one.
Posted by: mrcoaster
I'm an airline crew member (not SWA) and the standard policy we have is that you have to request and pay for oxygen needed in advance. You may not bring your own oxygen on board the aircraft. I've seen them come up with a last minute bottle if there was one available, but if you don't request it in advance, you are most definitely risking not being able to board the aircraft.
Obviously, in this case, granny's family was more worried about their precious vacation than in granny's well-being.
Posted by: nmiller855
mp2526,
Even though I make sure my carry on bags are always small enough to fit under the seat, they checked it saying all the overhead space was taken. I told them I could just put it under the seat because, unlike all the others around me, mine would fit. They told me it wouldn't be fair to make an exception for me. As I said before, if I had been on my way out of town instead of on my way back, I would not have parted with my bag since it met their regulations and held my everyday needed medications.
Posted by: aaronw
My thoughts:
Naval academy girl and dad:
So, he didn't bring the ticket and he expected.. what? Always e-ticket. I can't think of ANY reason why you wouldn't e-ticket. one thing less to lose. I wonder, though, if he comes up with the paper ticket, they'll refund the price he paid for that one, or the price he paid at the counter? Presumably it sounded like he was paying more buying one then (which makes sense). They should only refund the price for the ticket he lost, but they might refund the one he had to buy...
Kudos to the girl for telling her dad to accept some personal responsibility.
Middle eastern (?) group with old lady and medication in checked baggage:
Come on now, rule ONE is 'medication goes in the carry-on'... that's just planning for the worst, and is what is advised in all sorts of publications. As far as bag matching goes, I also was under the impression that that was the current policy, but I don't know enough about that end of the business.
unaccompanied minor and mom
So, was he standby or not? If he paid full fare, why was he standing out at the gate and everyone else was already on the plane? i.e., why they were only asking for volunteers? If he paid full fare, then as people check in at the counter(s), then they should know at that time that they are overseated or whatever the correct term is. (before boarding). Then they will go voluntary bumping, then involuntary bumping to get the seat count down. I would have to believe that SWA's involuntary bump policy protects unaccompanied minors. Were they late or something? But I can't imagine they were late because it looks like they had a LOT of time there. Dude waving to the ''camera'': Thanks a lot.
group needing oxygen:
Well, we've been there before, so no need to rehash that. if that's the policy, that's the policy, and I assume it was made for good reasons and I don't know enough about the situation. Most people don't realize that 100% O2 is *extremely* flammable and needs to be handled in an appropriate manner.
couple bringing kid back from China:
What, we didn't even get a chance to delay their flight or connect them through Kalamazoo? Oh well. Sometimes it all works out I guess. Good for them.
Posted by: mp2526
quote:
Originally posted by nmiller855
mp2526,
Even though I make sure my carry on bags are always small enough to fit under the seat, they checked it saying all the overhead space was taken. I told them I could just put it under the seat because, unlike all the others around me, mine would fit. They told me it wouldn't be fair to make an exception for me. As I said before, if I had been on my way out of town instead of on my way back, I would not have parted with my bag since it met their regulations and held my everyday needed medications.
What airline was this? What exception would they be making, they all pretty much allow two carry on bags, one in the overhead and one for under the seat in front of you. Maybe your bag was too big in their eyes to fit in the space in front of you. You do technically have to fit it all the way under the seat and it can't be hanging out were your feet are.
Posted by: nmiller855
It was Southwest Airline. I bought a bag that said it was designed as an acceptable carryon size and have tested it in the little boxes they have showing the aprroved size. I make sure I don't over-pack it by carrying only 1 change of clothes, medication, toothbrush, toothpaste & deoderant. I check a bag with everything else. I also carry a small purse but usually have room for it in the carryon bag.
Posted by: mp2526
quote:
Originally posted by nmiller855
It was Southwest Airline. I bought a bag that said it was designed as an acceptable carryon size and have tested it in the little boxes they have showing the aprroved size. I make sure I don't over-pack it by carrying only 1 change of clothes, medication, toothbrush, toothpaste & deoderant. I check a bag with everything else. I also carry a small purse but usually have room for it in the carryon bag.
Right, but that little box is for the overhead bags, the ones that fit under the seat are typically smaller bags. So I can see why they made you check it if it didn't look like it would fit under the seat (at least in their eyes)
Posted by: FatherTed
Hey, let's not forget the '12 year old blonde girl." :rolleyes:
:D
Posted by: jsmeeker
quote:
Originally posted by aaronw
My thoughts:
Naval academy girl and dad:
So, he didn't bring the ticket and he expected.. what? Always e-ticket. I can't think of ANY reason why you wouldn't e-ticket. one thing less to lose. I wonder, though, if he comes up with the paper ticket, they'll refund the price he paid for that one, or the price he paid at the counter?
Yes.. My impression was that they would refund the price of the ticket he bought at the counter just prior to the flight.
I haven't flown on a paper ticket in a long, long time.. But there ARE reasons you may want one, although they are becoming less needed. Early on in e-tickets days, it wasn't easy or even possible to use and e-ticket from one airline on another.. Their systems weren't setup to do interline ticketing agreements with electronic tickets.. It was all based on paper tickets.. However, I believe these issues have been mostly addressed by the big US airlines.
About the only time you'll see people recommend paper these days is for "complex" international itineraries that use multiple, foreign airlines.
Speaking of lost/stolen tickets... Several years ago, I traveled to Orlando with my parents to attend a wedding, and to visit my mom's mother. Well, my mom's purse was stolen at the hotel, and it had her tickets and my father's tickets (I bought my ticket my self and got an e-ticket, like normal). Anyway, American Airlines was easy to deal with.. She just called them, told them what happened.. When we went to the airport in Orlando to fly back home, they had to fill out a simple affadavit stating that the tickets had been stolen.. There were no fees, no new tickets to buy. IT was a simple transaction. No problem in any way from anybody at American.
Posted by: Todd
Was one post not enough Jeff??
:D
Posted by: jsmeeker
quote:
Originally posted by Todd
Was one post not enough Jeff??
:D
weird forum issue.. I added to the post. But for somereason, I got part of it posted as a post, then the the whole post was posted.
Posted by: IJustLikeTivo
quote:
Originally posted by bicker
I believe you're mistaken. Southwest's recommendation if you need oxygen is to fly a higher-priced airline.
Cute. Standard policy really. For liability reason virtually no airline will let you bring your own O2. You can have it but they must provide it.
Posted by: JPinAZ
quote:
Originally posted by IJustLikeTivo
Cute. Standard policy really. For liability reason virtually no airline will let you bring your own O2. You can have it but they must provide it.
I dunno. I think it's to make more money. My mother in law needs O2 (not 24/7 but would for a plane trip) & was quoted $400 per leg for O2. Better hope you don't have a layover.
Posted by: jsmeeker
quote:
Originally posted by JPinAZ
I dunno. I think it's to make more money. My mother in law needs O2 (not 24/7 but would for a plane trip) & was quoted $400 per leg for O2. Better hope you don't have a layover.
you think?? How many times have you seen a passenger on O2 on a commerical airliner? I can't recall ever seeing it.. I've been flying 20+ round trips per year for the past several years.
Posted by: GregA
quote:
...Heinous woman...granny...
Obscenities, threats, bad attitude, yelling, crying...pretty obvious that she is a product of her upbringing. Taking her mother back to the hospital so they could go on vacation...the old lady reaped what she sowed. Wonder what the grandmother was like? Wonder how many male suicides there are in the family...I was watching for 'all hell to break loose'; did I miss it?
I feel sorry for the boy, he's growing up in that same household. We'll probably see him again on Airline 2015...
The really scary part is that these people all have the right to vote...
Posted by: xix_84
No-one has mentioned the nice bit of editing where grandma was saying "There's no way they'll leave me behind." Cut to nightmare woman: "Well my son and I are going to Las Vegas today no matter what." Classic.
Not only that, but nightmare woman was arguing with the SWA cs rep that her mother definitely won't even need oxygen on the flight and the doctor knows nothing, meanwhile her mother is outside on the concourse with the oxygen cylinder on and a tube stuck up her nose!
Slight disconnect?
The only other thing I was curious about was for the medication problem, I know the NY flight was their last one of the day, but since SWA has very few non-stops, wasn't there the possibility that they could pull the bag in transit and send it back to the origin airport, so they'd get the medication back that night?
Posted by: bobbi
I've lost a paper ticket before (my employer had booked the flight and bought paper tickets...I never do). I felt like an absolute twit, and was about as meek as could be when I got to the airport. I knew what an idiot I was, I wasn't about to blame the airline for my idiocy.
If I remember right, I had to pay $50 (this was on American), and got on my flight with no problem.
I now insist on e-tickets. :D
As for seeing stuff like this in the airport...I was stuck in Las Vegas on Sunday/Monday thanks to bad weather. I was supposed to fly out early afternoon on Sunday, flew out Monday morning. I saw so many people acting like this, yelling and screaming at the airlines (as if they'd caused the rain), getting drunk, it was my own live action version of Airline. Made spending that many hours in the airport a little better, at least.
Posted by: TonyD79
A lot of commentary on this and other Airline threads assumes that passengers KNOW what to do. What about casual passengers, which most SWA folk are? They don't know every regulation and don't read the fine print, which is tough to find.
Even for savvy travellers. I had NO idea that SWA doesn't have a ticket replacement policy. I have lost several tickets over the years with other airlines and had to pay a fee each time but it was not the same as rebuying the ticket. Don't give me crap about paper tickets lying around. They all have record numbers so they can be tracked in the system. If they blow it on that, too bad, SWA.
Some other thoughts:
The medication issue. So they kind of messed up. SWA was being stupid. One, they have a policy to not buy tickets for other airlines in certain situations because they WANT TO KEEP THE MONEY FOR THEMSELVES. They are NOT about customer satisfaction. If that scenario didn't bring it home, then what would. The woman was facing the possibility of getting very sick or dying and all SWA was saying was "Sorry, we can't do anything about the situation we helped create." (BTW, never once did I hear them advise the passenger to keep meds with them in the future, either.)
The "blonde" girl. Why in the world did SWA not know that the girl was on the flight? Major security issue here. They suggested calling the people who put her on on the other end????
Same goes for the suddenly open seat for the 10 year old paying full fare who got bumped because SWA has the most ridiculous seating policies in air travel. Huh? In our security conscious world, they would STOP THAT PLANE to find out why their counts didn't match. (Maybe it was an old woman with medicine in the luggage compartment???)
But why I bother to post on these Airline threads is that it is sickening to have someone quote a little know regulation within the fine print like everyone is supposed to know that. Especially with SWA. Their rules are different than the majority of the airlines. And from what I am seeing on this show, most of them are set up to screw the passenger.
Posted by: TampaThunder
There's some sense behind the saying, "You get what you pay for." If you want to fly on the cheap, don't expect warm and fuzzy when things don't go right for you.
Bottom line is it is our responsibility as passengers to eliminate these FUBAR situations. Regulations hard to find? True. Impossible to find? No.
Can't prove your child is under two years old and should fly free? Lost your ticket? Got drunk in the bar? Don't want anybody to inspect your rifle you'd like to carry on board? Need to bring on canisters of compressed air? Got there late and the plane left? Got there late and the plane is full with no room for you? Packed your medically necessary drugs into checked baggage?
C'mon, people!! Step up and take some responsibility. Yes, Southwest Airlines is a business and will do what they can to make sure they don't lose money on any individual passenger. They offer some of the lowest prices out there. If their policies and procedures inconvenience 5% of their passengers that think the world revolves around them, so be it. The other 95% who follow the rules get to fly less expensively and for every little boy that was looking forward to his trip to Vegas there are 10 families that had a great time.
Posted by: Worf
Exactly. I mean, first off, if children under 2 fly free, would it not be reasonable to expect some sort of proof? This isn't like those carnivals where children under 6 get reduced rates and you were 6 years 1 month old... (i.e., be prepared to pay, for there's no law saying two year old fly free).
Lost ticket? Last time I checked, I had to pay for another one. They're like cash - not specifically coded to one particular passenger (sure they may be linked to a name, but two people with the same name aren't uncommon...)
The rest, I'd expect some people to have read up on the latest regulations. If a nailclipper isn't allowed on board, you'd think several other items might possible fall under the same restriction? And aircraft, once airborne, can't immediately stop for any medical emergency. They can land at the nearest airport, but that may still take a good half hour to accomplish! More if you're travelling overseas...
Same with checked baggage and medication. I don't know, but last I checked, there was well... lost baggage! If you can't go a day without it, and lost baggage and take upwards of a day to recover...
Posted by: h3kb4y2k
quote:
Originally posted by aaronw
Naval academy girl and dad:
For the record, she was not from the Naval Academy. She appeared to be a recent graduate of Boot Camp or Service School in Chicago.
Posted by: pmyers
I thought for sure they said Naval Acadamy
Posted by: djheini
quote:
Originally posted by pmyers
I thought for sure they said Naval Acadamy
I remember them calling her a naval cadet, which I just assumed was the Naval Academy.
edit: spelling
edit2 to add: When I went to aetv.com to see if I could confirm it, I was surprised that the producers thought the girl/dad/lost tickets storyline was a bigger part of the episode than the lady whose meds got on the flight while she didn't, which wasn't even listed as a storyline. Didn't they only spend like 2 minutes with the lost tickets guy?
Posted by: TonyD79
quote:
Originally posted by Worf
Lost ticket? Last time I checked, I had to pay for another one. They're like cash - not specifically coded to one particular passenger (sure they may be linked to a name, but two people with the same name aren't uncommon...)
Riiiiight. So the person who finds a lost ticket just happens to have the same name.
Wrong-o! MOST airlines make you pay a fee for a lost ticket replacement but NOT FULL FARE.
With your reasoning of a ticket not tied to a particular passenger, how does ANY ticket work?
As for reading up on latest regulations...WHERE? You expect everyone to search webpages? They are pushing E-tickets which don't exactly come with a ton of fine print.
Stop making excuses for airlines. Sure, people need to think more but I could hardly blame someone who may fly once very ten years to know all the ins and outs. Or someone who normally flys "real" airlines suddenly confronted with the SWA "regulations."
Posted by: jsmeeker
quote:
Originally posted by djheini
I remember them calling her a naval cadet, which I just assumed was the Naval Academy.
I'm positive they said cadet as well.. And when I here Naval Cadet, I automatically think Naval Academy in Annapolis.. I really don't think it's a stretch for me to think that and instead expect me to know the differences in uniforms.
Back to the checked bag with the meds. Don't forget, the passenger missed her fight becasue of Southwest.. They screwed around with getting her a wheel chair to transport her to her gate. I'm pretty sure the SW fully admitted that the airline blundered.
Posted by: trainman
quote:
Originally posted by h3kb4y2k
For the record, she was not from the Naval Academy. She appeared to be a recent graduate of Boot Camp or Service School in Chicago.
To be specific, I'd say with near certainty that she had been at Great Lakes Naval Training Center, which is about 30 miles north of the city itself.
Posted by: faerie
quote:
Originally posted by TonyD79
As for reading up on latest regulations...WHERE? You expect everyone to search webpages? They are pushing E-tickets which don't exactly come with a ton of fine print.
Stop making excuses for airlines. Sure, people need to think more but I could hardly blame someone who may fly once very ten years to know all the ins and outs. Or someone who normally flys "real" airlines suddenly confronted with the SWA "regulations."
I think it's 50/50. People have some responsibility to check out the rules and regulations when they buy a ticket. Buyer Beware and all that. Besides, ignorance is never an excuse. Most important information can be found on the southwest website. Just because you are not aware something is a law never excuses you from punishment should you break that law. I think that this is along the same lines.
Posted by: bicker
quote:
Originally posted by Todd
Do they not still have all of your information in their computers so that they could get you on anyway?
The problem is that the paper ticket still exists somewhere, and can be accepted as cash for another flight. That's what paper tickets are: cash reminted. Now that there are e-tickets, the only purpose for asking for and getting a paper ticket is to have cash-value held in your hands, and as such, you must be responsible for safeguarding it like cash, and facing the consequences of losing it, as if you lost cash.
Posted by: bicker
quote:
Originally posted by TonyD79
A lot of commentary on this and other Airline threads assumes that passengers KNOW what to do. What about casual passengers, which most SWA folk are? They don't know every regulation and don't read the fine print, which is tough to find.
It makes sense for them to take responsibility for failing to learn the terms and conditions of the rather subtantial purchase they made, and accept that they implicitly agreed to things they didn't realize. They should be mature enough to be angry at no one but themselves.
Personal accountability. When will the typical American take up that ethic again?quote:
The medication issue. So they kind of messed up. SWA was being stupid.
Incorrect. They have a policy, designed to satisfy objectives. The customer is NOT always right. Making the customer "always right" is a fast-track to bankrupcy in a public-facing competitive commercial enterprise. quote:
One, they have a policy to not buy tickets for other airlines in certain situations because they WANT TO KEEP THE MONEY FOR THEMSELVES.
This is directly attribute to the CUSTOMER DEMAND for low fares. If the fares were higher, then the airline could legitimately join the inter-line agreements with the other airlines. Southwest can't get into any such inter-line agreements specifically because their CUSTOMERS DEMAND lower fares. If you want to attribute greed to anyone, attribute it to the CUSTOMER as much as any other party in this transaction.
Personal accountability again. Why, again, assume, as a customer, that everything is always some company's fault? Easy scapegoat, sure.quote:
They are NOT about customer satisfaction.
Which, of course, is silly, given that they're the #1 airline for customer satisfacation. The disconnect is that some people evidently place grievously unreasonable expectations on others, while refusing to place any reasonable expectations on themselves.quote:
The "blonde" girl. Why in the world did SWA not know that the girl was on the flight? Major security issue here.
On the contrary. They did know the girl was on the flight; just not that she was a minor. The fault clearly lies with the family member on the out-bound end of the flight (assuming there even was one, and the child was not simply dropped off) who failed to identify the passenger as a child needing supervision. (Remember, it is perfectly permissible for a minor of aget 16 to fly, unaccompanied and unsupervised by the flight crew -- it is up to the passenger or chaperone to identify the passenger as needing supervision.)quote:
Their rules are different than the majority of the airlines. And from what I am seeing on this show, most of them are set up to screw the passenger.
Rather, their rules are set up to cater directly to the #1 priority of their typical passenger: KEEP THE FARES LOW.
Posted by: bicker
quote:
Originally posted by TampaThunder
C'mon, people!! Step up and take some responsibility.
Yes! Yes! Yes!
Posted by: bicker
quote:
Originally posted by TonyD79
Riiiiight. So the person who finds a lost ticket just happens to have the same name.
That's not the point. Remember a few episodes ago when that guy tried to use an expired ticket. We later found out he tried the same stunt several times. Eventually, the way he figures it, he'll get through a weak spot in the system. He's probably right, so the airline (on behalf of its customers who want low fares) has a vested interest in eliminating that possibility completely.quote:
As for reading up on latest regulations...WHERE? You expect everyone to search webpages? They are pushing E-tickets which don't exactly come with a ton of fine print.
E-tickets come with exactly the same fine print as regular tickets. Regardless, anyone who spends hundreds of dollars on something, without learning what it is they're buying, deserves what they get.
quote:
Stop making excuses for airlines.
Stop making excuses for passengers unwilling to take any personal responsibility for their actions and decisions.
Posted by: SoldOnTiVo
quote:
Originally posted by bicker
The customer is NOT always right. Making the customer "always right" is a fast-track to bankrupcy in a public-facing competitive commercial enterprise. ...[/B]
Dogbert's management training:
There are two essential rules of management
One: The customer is always right.
Two: They must be punished for their arrogance
:D
Posted by: Z'Loth
Has anyone creating a "Airline" drinking game yet?
IIRC: Southwest was the only airline that agreed to the filiming of the series, and they are receiving no compensation other than their name mention. They are also the only airline that is consistantly showing a profit. They apparently also have no editorial control, because there have been episodes when a Southwest employee messed up.
Posted by: rich
How did you like that mealy-mouthed doctor who said verbally that it was okay for the elderly lady to fly without an oxygen bottle, but then refused to put it in writing?
I was also intrigued by the comment that "other airlines won't accept our tickets".
Posted by: Groucho
quote:
Originally posted by rich
I was also intrigued by the comment that "other airlines won't accept our tickets".
This is true. Anybody who's travelled a lot has probably experienced being bumped from a flight or having a flight cancelled, with the airline transferring your ticket on the next available flight...even if that flight is on another airline.
Southwest doesn't have such an agreement. I'm not sure of the particulars, but I imagine it has something to do with keeping their rates lower than the competition. They are a "bargain" airline.
I don't fly Southwest too often, but in my experience they give a lot better service than the more expensive airlines.
Posted by: jsmeeker
quote:
Originally posted by rich
I was also intrigued by the comment that "other airlines won't accept our tickets".
Southwest doesn't have interline agreements with other airlines. That's what that statement means.
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