TiVo Community Forums Archives - Be able to change channel and not lose saved portion

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Be able to change channel and not lose saved portion
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Posted by: ayejay

Now that my daughter has figured out that if she changes the channel with the remote and daddy happens to be behind on the program he is watching, that he loses all of the program, including parts he hasn't watched yet, and that makes him really mad. It would be nice not to have to record every show I pause during just to make sure the channel button isn't pushed and I lose everything.

Posted by: martinp13

Amen... I've bitched about that for a LONG time. Just leave the buffer alone, dammit... if it has a channel change in it, that's cool!

Posted by: dwarner

quote:
Originally posted by ayejay
Now that my daughter has figured out that if she changes the channel with the remote and daddy happens to be behind on the program he is watching, that he loses all of the program, including parts he hasn't watched yet, and that makes him really mad. It would be nice not to have to record every show I pause during just to make sure the channel button isn't pushed and I lose everything.

Agreed! One of the most frustrating things about Tivo for me is watching live TV "behind" and hitting the channel button accidentally, losing the buffer. Last time, I was watching an excellent show, just before the granf finale, the commercial break started. Out of habit, I hit the channelk change button to check out what else was on during the break, (BIG mistake)..
In this respect, Tivo damages the live TV experience, in that it can cause you to LOSE programming..
Still, to lessen confusion, I'd suggest showing different buffered channels in different colors on the progress bar. Also, show the channel number in the cursor aor nearby, when scrolling back.
Additionally, increase the buffer time if space is available.

Posted by: aaronwt

Out of habbit, if there is something I plan on watching like that, I always hit the record button. That way I know the show will be there no matter what.

Posted by: daperlman

you are basically requesting Tivo record everything without erasing your now playing shows... that would require another (or a larger partitioned) hard drive...

That would make TiVo a lot more expensive, but if the demand was there I'd imagine it is something they'd look into

Posted by: markpickett

quote:
Originally posted by daperlman
you are basically requesting Tivo record everything without erasing your now playing shows... that would require another (or a larger partitioned) hard drive...

He never asked for the buffer to be longer than 30 minutes. He just asked for it not to be deleted on a channel change. That doesn't require any new hardware.

Posted by: BrettStah

It would be great to have this and some other features available via some sort of advanced options screen. I think the default behavior should remain the same, however.

Posted by: daperlman

quote:
Originally posted by markpickett
He never asked for the buffer to be longer than 30 minutes. He just asked for it not to be deleted on a channel change. That doesn't require any new hardware.

right now it is up to 30 minutes.. period. If you change it the clock starts again... to save the buffer it is treated like a recording...

That is a whole new ball of wax, your TiVo has to check conflicts and SUID's etc...

Posted by: BrettStah

Daperlman, the request as I understand it is to continue having a 30 minute buffer, but to modify it so that channel changes do not reset the buffer. So if I'm on CNN for 10 minutes, and then flip to Fox News for 10 minutes, and then back to CNN for 10 minutes, I'd have 30 minutes of a buffer, rather than only 10 minutes of CNN.

Posted by: Jonathan_S

quote:
Originally posted by daperlman
to save the buffer it is treated like a recording... That is a whole new ball of wax, your TiVo has to check conflicts and SUID's etc...

I think you are misunderstanding what ayejay is asking for.

He isn't asking that the buffer be permanently saved in the Now Playing list. He is just asking that the buffer always keep the last 30 minutes, even if there was a channel change.

Here's an example
You are watching on channel 4 at 8pm, at 8:20 you switch to channel 202, and at 8:25 you switch back to channel 4 and keep watching till 8:45.

Currently:
at 8:20 you have 30 minutes of buffer of channel 4. You change to channel 202, and you now have 0 minutes of buffer. At 8:25 you have 5 minutes of buffer of 202. You change the channel to 4, and you now have 0 minutes of buffer. At 8:45 you have 20 minutes of buffer.

ayejay's suggestion:
at 8:20 you have 30 minutes of buffer on channel 4. You change to channel 202, you still have 30 minutes of buffer from channel 4. At 8:25 you have 25 minutes of buffer from channel 4 and 5 minutes of buffer from channel 202. You change the channel to 4, and you still have 30 minutes of buffer (25 min from 4, 5 min from 202). At 8:45 you have 30 minutes of buffer (5 min from 4, then 5 min from 202, then 20 min from 4).

The buffer never gets larger than 30 minutes, it just doesn't shrink to 0 when you change the channel. So no extra conflict checking, no extra storage issues to deal with, just a 30 minute buffer that could contain video from more than one channel.

Posted by: daperlman

quote:
Originally posted by BrettStah
Daperlman, the request as I understand it is to continue having a 30 minute buffer, but to modify it so that channel changes do not reset the buffer. So if I'm on CNN for 10 minutes, and then flip to Fox News for 10 minutes, and then back to CNN for 10 minutes, I'd have 30 minutes of a buffer, rather than only 10 minutes of CNN.

That is indeed different than what I was thinking he was asking for.

So in that scenario (following your example) what if it had been on FNC for 30 minutes or more? What happens when channel is changed? Does it not save anything on CNN (but not erase the hour of FNC)?

TiVo is always on so this might happen a lot.

Posted by: daperlman

quote:
Originally posted by Jonathan_S
I think you are misunderstanding what ayejay is asking for.

He isn't asking that the buffer be permanently saved in the Now Playing list. He is just asking that the buffer always keep the last 30 minutes, even if there was a channel change.

Here's an example
You are watching on channel 4 at 8pm, at 8:20 you switch to channel 202, and at 8:25 you switch back to channel 4 and keep watching till 8:45.

Currently:
at 8:20 you have 30 minutes of buffer of channel 4. You change to channel 202, and you now have 0 minutes of buffer. At 8:25 you have 5 minutes of buffer of 202. You change the channel to 4, and you now have 0 minutes of buffer. At 8:45 you have 20 minutes of buffer.

ayejay's suggestion:
at 8:20 you have 30 minutes of buffer on channel 4. You change to channel 202, you still have 30 minutes of buffer from channel 4. At 8:25 you have 25 minutes of buffer from channel 4 and 5 minutes of buffer from channel 202. You change the channel to 4, and you still have 30 minutes of buffer (25 min from 4, 5 min from 202). At 8:45 you have 30 minutes of buffer (5 min from 4, then 5 min from 202, then 20 min from 4).

The buffer never gets larger than 30 minutes, it just doesn't shrink to 0 when you change the channel. So no extra conflict checking, no extra storage issues to deal with, just a 30 minute buffer that could contain video from more than one channel.

Ah I see... so instead of buffer being instantly wiped on chan change... it is slowly replaced by buffer on what is being watched. That might make sense... but I would still think that would be a lot of work for them, and the demand probably is not there... considering that currently one can just record the buffer b/f changing if they want to keep it.

Posted by: BrettStah

Without seeing the source code it's hard to know how hard or easy it would be to implement, but my guess is that there is a line of code that, upon each channel change, makes a call to a ClearBuffer function. So in theory if they added in this as an optional feature (I doubt they'd change the default behavior), they would just add in a conditional check... "If the 'Don't Clear the Buffer on Channel Changes' is selected, don't call the ClearBuffer function" type of thing.

Posted by: RedLenses

I agree, code is code - who cares how hard it is for the engineers - they are getting paid and if the product is more friendly they will be more successful! The idea here is to make the usage of Tivo better - meaning prevent losing the show you are watching semi-live because of a channel change.

It's great that you always record shows you are watching semi-live, but many people just watch - and Tivo's features should be aimed at what many people do - not what very few people do...

I don't see a customer-driven reason for resetting the 30 minute buffer when the channel changes.

Posted by: ccwf

You can preserved the buffer if you have a cable or satellite box by changing the channel on the cable or satellite box with its remote rather than TiVo's.

Posted by: phone1

Who watches live TV? The buffer size or content is a non-issue for me.

Posted by: rickertk

My memory is that someone from Tivo at one point said that they did it this way because when they kept the buffer through channel changes, the video got fairly ugly for a second, and it was unappealing to the user.

Keith

Posted by: TreborPugly

The other Tivo issue is that they want to have an accurate description of what you are watching if you hit the Display button. If they buffer doesn't get purged, then what should the Display show?

Suppose you are seriously channel surfing and change to 10 different channels in 5 minutes? What would the Display for any segment of that be, if you rewound through this buffer?

And the reason other than just user info for correct program information is that if you hit the Record button, it knows what you want to record. Suppose you watched 10 minutes of Dailyshow, then 10 minutes of news, then went back in the buffer to the dailyshow part of your buffer, and tried to Record it?

Messy, messy stuff, although it is currently capable of handling at least 2 different items from the same channel in the buffer. (ie, 8:15-8:30 one show, 8:30-8:45 a different show. If you use Display at the 8:20 mark, it will show a different description than using Display at the 8:40 mark)

I for one, would be happy for this to be messy, with no Record option from live TV if you've got multiple shows in the buffer.

Posted by: dirtypacman

To eliminate loss of buffer when channel changing.

I have my tivo set up as my secondary tuner (input #1)---meaning that I do not watch television through tivo. I still use my cable box (input #2) and remote to change channels and watch some of my daily shows. This is how it would work for you.. You can change your channels all day long and since your not using the Tivo remote it does record all your channel changing and so forth right in the 1/2 hour buffer.

So when I get a phone call or have to get up I simply just walk away. If by chance the channel is changed it will still be recording in the buffer I just need to switch back to the original channel. Then to input #1 on my tv and R<R< till Im back where I left off, once I reach real time again with the show I go right back to input #2 (cable box input) or sometimes finish it off direct through tivo.

REMEBER THIS IS ALL BEING DONE WITH CABLE REMOTE not Tivos.
Hope that helps someone I have found it to work for me.

That might be a work around for some of you who find this to be real troublesome.