TiVo Community Forums Archives - Anyone watch "Small Town Ecstacy" on HBO's Investigative Reports?

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Anyone watch "Small Town Ecstacy" on HBO's Investigative Reports?
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Posted by: nayrbb

What a truly disturbing show. That 40 year old guy rolling on X with his 15 and 12 years olds and refusing to stop even after he lost visitation rights and went to jail. I know all families have their crap to deal with but that was unbelievable.

Here's a link:

http://www.hbo.com/americaundercover/ecstasy/

Posted by: David Platt

You're right; it was really disturbing. The look on his daughter's face was absolutely heartbreakingwhen she realized what her dad's choice would be if it came down to choosing between never seeing his kids again and doing Ecstasy.

Posted by: byrnebv

The father picked one heck of a time to take an interest in drugs. He has so much to lose and doesn't care that he did. In this case, drugs are the devil. His kids deserve better.

Posted by: gseeg

Yep. One of the most disturbing things I have ever watched. The story itself is unbelievable enough, and then when you heap on the fact that he let himself be filmed is too much for me to fathom. At least at the end, the kids seemed like maybe they might be seeing the direction that drugs take you. Even the son's drug dealing roomie seemed like he had more brains than the dad, about letting the 13 year old do drugs. The father has to be one of the sickest people I've ever seen.

Glenn

Posted by: anolin

Really a sad, disturbing story.

His daughter asks him if he still considers himself a Christian and he says: "I believe that Hitler went to heaven."

Wow.

Posted by: knownzero

Disturbing?!? Not quite. If you think that's disturbing, have I got some stories for you. Like the saying goes, you ain't seen nothin' yet....
Wow, are you guys really that sheltered? I know most people on here are fairly conservative, but wow.... Please don't take offense by that, but it just seems that I've seen a whole lot of stuff and family situations waaay more messed up than that.

Posted by: gseeg

quote:
Originally posted by knownzero
Disturbing?!? Not quite. If you think that's disturbing, have I got some stories for you. Like the saying goes, you ain't seen nothin' yet....
Wow, are you guys really that sheltered? I know most people on here are fairly conservative, but wow.... Please don't take offense by that, but it just seems that I've seen a whole lot of stuff and family situations waaay more messed up than that.

Well, I hope I'm never so "worldly" as you that seeing a father participating in and encouraging his 18, 15, and 13 year old children into doing drugs doesn't disturb me. :rolleyes:

To me, a parent abusing a child physically, sexually, or mentally will always be the most disturbing, and I consider it the ultimate betrayal of trust and responsibility.

Glenn

Posted by: nayrbb

I agree Glenn...of course I've seen many more visually disturbing things in my life but buying and letting your young kids do X on camera and then being able to go home or to work or to sleep for that matter and rationalizing that "they would do it anyway" is just plain disturbing. Being a father myself I couldn't even comprehend doing something like that. It's just absolutley F*#%ed.

Posted by: feldon23

He had problems before the drugs.

Yet another attempt to demonize Ecstacy.

All ecstacy does is loosen your inhibitions (much like alcohol) and doesn't "make you" do anything. It just shows what you would REALLY do if your inhibitions were dropped (aka, having sex with someone vs. not, making comments about your boss, friends, etc.).

Posted by: nayrbb

feldon23....you sound just like that Scott guy on the show. Ecstacy is a dangerous drug that has serious long term affects to the brain not to mention it can just plain kill you. Plus you never know if you are really getting what you think is X. Anything made in a lab and mixed with all sorts of different chemicals does far more than "loosen your inhibitions." What an utterly ignorant reply.

Posted by: byrnebv

quote:
Originally posted by knownzero
Disturbing?!? Not quite. If you think that's disturbing, have I got some stories for you. Like the saying goes, you ain't seen nothin' yet....
Wow, are you guys really that sheltered? I know most people on here are fairly conservative, but wow.... Please don't take offense by that, but it just seems that I've seen a whole lot of stuff and family situations waaay more messed up than that.

I'm glad I don't live "Somewhere between zero and infinity." ;) Sounds like a really scary place.

Posted by: nayrbb

Oh and here's what Ecstacy does while it just allows your inhibitions to be lowered.

Brain imaging research in humans indicates that MDMA causes injury to the brain, affecting neurons that use the chemical serotonin to communicate with other neurons. The serotonin system plays a direct role in regulating mood, aggression, sexual activity, sleep, and sensitivity to pain. Many of the risks users face with MDMA use are similar to those found with the use of cocaine and amphetamines:

Psychological difficulties, including confusion, depression, sleep problems, drug craving, severe anxiety, and paranoia - during and sometimes weeks after taking MDMA.

Physical symptoms such as muscle tension, involuntary teeth clenching, nausea, blurred vision, rapid eye movement, faintness, and chills or sweating.

Increases in heart rate and blood pressure, a special risk for people with circulatory or heart disease.

Also, there is evidence that people who develop a rash that looks like acne after using MDMA may be risking severe side effects, including liver damage, if they continue to use the drug.

Research links MDMA use to long-term damage to those parts of the brain critical to thought and memory. One study, in primates, showed that exposure to MDMA for 4 days caused brain damage that was evident 6 to 7 years later.

MDA, the parent drug of MDMA, is an amphetamine-like drug that has also been abused and is similar in chemical structure to MDMA. Research shows that MDA also destroys serotonin-producing neurons in the brain.

MDMA also is related in its structure and effects to methamphetamine, which has been shown to cause degeneration of neurons containing the neurotransmitter dopamine. Damage to these neurons is the underlying cause of the motor disturbances seen in Parkinson's disease. Symptoms of this disease begin with lack of coordination and tremors and can eventually result in a form of paralysis.

Posted by: stormsweeper

quote:
Originally posted by nayrbb
feldon23....you sound just like that Scott guy on the show. Ecstacy is a dangerous drug that has serious long term affects to the brain not to mention it can just plain kill you. Plus you never know if you are really getting what you think is X. Anything made in a lab and mixed with all sorts of different chemicals does far more than "loosen your inhibitions." What an utterly ignorant reply.

Well, I'm not going to go into the research on MDMA, which has been heavily slanted in both directions.

It still is a fallacy to say that MDMA was this guy's problem. He has deeper emotional and psychological issues. The drug certainly isn't helping, but it's not THIS drug in particular. This same thing happens a thousand times over with alcohol abuse, but we don't see HBO specials about it.

Posted by: Darin

quote:
Originally posted by stormsweeper
Well, I'm not going to go into the research on MDMA, which has been heavily slanted in both directions.

I agree completely. If I really wanted, I could pull up a pretty long list of nasty things that research has shown happens from drinking diet cola. This guy abuses X because he has some serious problems. I really doubt it's the other way around.

Posted by: knownzero

quote:
I'm glad I don't live "Somewhere between zero and infinity." Sounds like a really scary place.

Trust me, sometimes it hasn't always been a nice place to be. I've seen a lot of stuff like this before from parents and their kids, so I guess that since I've been exposed to it for so long it's just a given. Bad thing it was heroin, not X so really, in the grand scheme of things as far as danger and abuse goes, X isn't nearly as bad. At least you can get out alive on X if you decide to quit, damaged, but alive...

Posted by: Fofer

quote:
Originally posted by anolin
Really a sad, disturbing story.

His daughter asks him if he still considers himself a Christian and he says: "I believe that Hitler went to heaven."

Wow.

Yes it was very disturbing, as the dad clearly had issues and his destructive mid-life crisis was tearing apart his family and the future of his children. But this comment in particular I think was taken out of context. The father was saying something to the effect that his belief in Christianity has diminished, but that he still believed that God loves *everyone,* even the worst amongst us.

I watched that sequence a few times, to try and see what I'd missed in the editing. No, the father wasn't turning into an anti-Semite on us to make matters worse. He was just trying to explain (with what little brain cells he has left) that he hangs on to the hope that God loves everyone as a human being, despite what mistakes/crimes/atrocities they might have committed on earth. To make his point he picked the worst human he could think of.

Granted, it's a perverse way to justify poor living, and perhaps just a way for him to sleep better at night. Either way, I felt bad for the family, I felt bad for the father, most of all I felt bad for the mother and her kids -- they are all in serious need of professional help.

Posted by: ttyler1999

Well, it looks like this guy was finally arrested based on the HBO documentary. I have to wonder why it took so long since it has been at lease a couple of months since the documentary aired. Also there is a quote from the D.A. where he said that he didn't think it was appropriate for the documentary crew to stand by and watch this man give his kids ecstasy (I had the same thought while watching the show). Now, I'm no prude (actually far from it;)), but where does someone making a documentary draw the line an step in and put a stop to things?

Posted by: pmyers

The guys at National Geographic could step in and save the gazelle from the tiger too.....

Posted by: bigcb37

I think this guys problem was the fact that he is an idiot. When you mix a drug like Ex with someone that clearly cannot make rational decisions that is what you get. People like him are why the masses oppose drug use. If people were smarter about their use then many of the negative steroetypes about drug users would be untrue.

In the show even the kids got tired of Ex...its a phase...he just couldnt get over it. Its a shame. I bet you those kids actually stay away from drugs because of their dad though. They have seen what can happen up close and personal. That will scare them from drug use I imagine.

Posted by: ttyler1999

quote:
Originally posted by pmyers
The guys at National Geographic could step in and save the gazelle from the tiger too.....

First of all these are human beings, not animals, and second of all this is a lot more up close and personal. Are you telling me that if you were filming a child for a documentary and someone came up and attacked or mugged that child that you would go right on filming?

Posted by: Darin

quote:
Originally posted by bigcb37
People like him are why the masses oppose drug use. If people were smarter about their use then many of the negative steroetypes about drug users would be untrue.

The masses aren't aware of the people who are smarter about their drug use. There's no reason for them to notice them. The only ones who stand out are those who, like this man, have some serious problems, and make some very bad decisions. Their lack of responsibility and reasonable decisions in their drug use, as in other aspects of their lives, worsens the effect, and they start a downward spiral. In the end, the drugs get blamed for their woes, and that blame is what the masses see.

Posted by: stormsweeper

quote:
Originally posted by ttyler1999

First of all these are human beings, not animals, and second of all this is a lot more up close and personal. Are you telling me that if you were filming a child for a documentary and someone came up and attacked or mugged that child that you would go right on filming?

Do you WATCH the news these days? Or any of those shows on Fox?

Posted by: bigcb37

quote:
Originally posted by Darin

The masses aren't aware of the people who are smarter about their drug use. There's no reason for them to notice them. The only ones who stand out are those who, like this man, have some serious problems, and make some very bad decisions. Their lack of responsibility and reasonable decisions in their drug use, as in other aspects of their lives, worsens the effect, and they start a downward spiral. In the end, the drugs get blamed for their woes, and that blame is what the masses see.

I couldn't agree with you more. Its the extreme cases that call attention. I blame that guys problems on his in ability to handle a drug, not the drug alone. Its just like alcohol, some people can handle it and some people become dependant on it. Its the same principle, but for some reason society says alcohol is okay and drugs are not. (some drugs I think are safer then alcohol, some are not and should be illegal)

Posted by: TiVolcano

quote:
Originally posted by bigcb37

I couldn't agree with you more. Its the extreme cases that call attention. I blame that guys problems on his in ability to handle a drug, not the drug alone. Its just like alcohol, some people can handle it and some people become dependant on it. Its the same principle, but for some reason society says alcohol is okay and drugs are not. (some drugs I think are safer then alcohol, some are not and should be illegal)

This isn't the best analogy to make. While abusing alcohol is certainly detrimental to your health, a glass of wine a day is actually good for you. Any amount of ecstasy is bad for you.

Posted by: ttyler1999

quote:
Originally posted by stormsweeper

Do you WATCH the news these days? Or any of those shows on Fox?

I assume you mean those "reality" shows on Fox where they show video that someone accidentally caught on tape. This is a case of someone filming a subject with the advance knowledge of what is going to happen.

From the website:

An unsettling, cautionary documentary, Small Town Ecstasy is the unexpected result of the filmmakers' search for a subject who would demonstrate the pervasive effect of "club drugs" on young people.

Posted by: bigcb37

quote:
Originally posted by TiVolcano

This isn't the best analogy to make. While abusing alcohol is certainly detrimental to your health, a glass of wine a day is actually good for you. Any amount of ecstasy is bad for you.

I meant in terms of abuse, either takes a certain amount of control. Ex is certainly bad for you. But other drugs such as pot are not nearly as destructive as alcohol. My point is more that either drugs or alcohol can be abused in the same way.

Who actually drinks a glass of wine a day solely for health anyways? People just like to say that "its actually good for you" ....I say it too ;)

Posted by: Knative

quote:
Originally posted by pmyers
The guys at National Geographic could step in and save the gazelle from the tiger too.....

This triggered a spark of memory from a while back regarding journalists and the Vietnam war.

quote:
Some years ago, there was a PBS television program that brought prominent citizens together to be intellectually prodded by a host who threw hypothetical situations at them. In one of these shows, the host asked TV anchor Peter Jennings what he would do if, while on patrol with a guerrilla force fighting U.S. troops, he learned that the guerrillas were going to ambush the Americans.

Jennings, visibly pained by such a prospect, said he wouldn�t be able to go on with the guerrillas; he would flee and try to alert the Americans. The host put the same question to Mike Wallace, known for his tough journalistic tactics. Wallace didn�t hesitate. He was a journalist first, he said, there to cover the news however it was made.

I don�t think Wallace made many friends among Americans viewing that program. But he made his case so forcefully that it swayed Jennings. On reflection, the anchor said, he thought he would follow Wallace�s lead after all.

Article link

Posted by: bigcb37

quote:
Originally posted by TiVolcano

This isn't the best analogy to make. While abusing alcohol is certainly detrimental to your health, a glass of wine a day is actually good for you. Any amount of ecstasy is bad for you.

Posted by: Darin

Man, I need to lay off the X, I'm getting serious deja vu. :eek:

Posted by: pmyers

quote:
Originally posted by ttyler1999

First of all these are human beings, not animals, and second of all this is a lot more up close and personal. Are you telling me that if you were filming a child for a documentary and someone came up and attacked or mugged that child that you would go right on filming?

I guess that would depend...if I was doing a documentary about kids that mugged people and then that same kid got mugged him/herself, then I probably wouldn't stop it.

I didn't mean to sound as harsh as my first post, but I just wanted to throw it out their for discussion.