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Firefly cancelled - It's official
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Posted by: aschucher

http://www.ew.com/ew/report/0,6115,...anceled,00.html

A sad, sad day. It deserves time to grow. You can't put a show on in the dead zone that is Friday night and expect anything. It was over before it even began.

:( :( :( :( :(

Posted by: ClutchBrake

That sucks so bad I can't even come up with the words to describe how disappointed I am. Of all the short-lived shows I have ever watched I will miss Firefly the most.

Posted by: Lori

It's not over yet. Fox has apparently released Joss to shop this to other nets--and Joss has some strings that he can pull at the WB and UPN.

I think that one of those would be a better home anyway.

Posted by: bprothero

I am not surprised that Fox killed this show... remember SPACE: ABOVE AND BEYOND? They sabotaged that show from the beginning. Fox is notorious for axing good shows if they aren't immediate hits. Guess we'll get more reality crud instead.

It is too bad because the show showed great potential. There were some very interesting characters that obviously would take us into an interesting story arc. Just what is River and why is the alliance after her? Is she a telepath? Weapon? Who are the creepy blue gloved boogey men hunting her down? Is Shepherd really a preacher? What is his story? What past is he trying to hide? What about Jayne? How would is character develope? Would he end up being the most loyal or betray them all? Why is the companion hanging out with them? I suspect that all of this would have played out into a wild roller coaster ride.

Maybe UPN or SCIFI might pick it up; but I wouldn't hold my breath. I just hope that Wheldon publishes a book(s) or at least tells us where he intended going with the show. Maybe another civil war and eventual overthrow of the facist Alliance?

Hey... at least I saved the episodes on VCD!

Brian

Posted by: Rcrew

Hey, buddy it up to Smallville!

Posted by: TV addict

quote:
Originally posted by bprothero
[BMaybe UPN or SCIFI might pick it up; but I wouldn't hold my breath. I just hope that Wheldon publishes a book(s) or at least tells us where he intended going with the show. Maybe another civil war and eventual overthrow of the facist Alliance?
[/B]

I think it would fit better on STARS Western channel.

Of course I biased. I stopped watching it after 4 episodes.

Posted by: dcheesi

Is it really true that it got the worst ratings of all shows from the networks!? I find it hard to believe that with all the lame new shows on TV, there wasn't one that bombed worse than Firefly. I suppose Fox's junior network status might skew things a little, but still....?

If it's true, then I'm afraid I can't blame them for killing it. There's a big difference between somewhat poor ratings and absolute bottom-of-the-barrel. As much as I loved this show, I can't be angry at a mass-market network for cancelling something nobody but me (or us) likes.

Posted by: Blahblah2000

I watched the first episode and immediately deleted my SP. Good riddance :)

Posted by: Teammate

It would be great to see it picked up by another network, but with as poor a ratings as stated in the article I wouldn't hold out hope. I have NEVER watched one of Joss' shows before, but I was attracted by the sci-fi nature of this program, but have stuck around because of the characters and the western feel. (The loss of this show and Farscape so close together is a bummer, yeah I know some Farscapes are still coming.)

Posted by: AJRitz

I think that UPN or WB might actually be viable alternatives, even if the ratings were totally abysmal at Fox. Three reasons: 1) Joss Whedon has valuable franchises already at UPN and WB, and one of them might offer a slot to Firefly as a trade-off for better terms on the Angel/Buffy deals. 2) The timeslot at Fox sucked, and the other nets know it. Given a reasonable time slot, the numbers likely would have been better. 3) Both UPN and WB are willing to put up with smaller numbers, and a solid, hardcore fan base that will come back week after week (and is firmly rooted in the valuable 18-34 demographic and even better yet probably skews male) is worth more to UPN and WB than total numbers right now.

-crossing my fingers for a WB/UPN savior-

Posted by: Hunter Green

It seems more than coincidence that TiVo reported Firefly as one of the top four shows in the new season that TiVonauts got season passes for, while in the general market, it died a painful death. Sure, we're techies with a heavy geek demographic slant and all that, but it's more than that. I think it proves how powerful the Time Slot Factor is, and how terrible this particular time slot is.

(And incidentally another reason for us to all evangelize (and Yahoo be damned) -- once TiVonauts are a big enough market share, a show will be able to blossom in a bad time slot.)

Posted by: Celusil

I think Firefly has the franchise potential that Star Trek Had. ST was canceled after it's second season ( I think) but of course because of the rich world Gene Roddenberry created, many spin offs movies and what not.

Wheadon (while skipping over flight times) has created a rich world with a lot of potential. I pointed this out to some fox address that I mailed to trying to keep the series a float.

I think the series can only get better. Anybody remember the first ST show (not the pilot) it was very rough and technically laughable. The writing in the first series is what got it through.

c

Posted by: TiVoOpsMgr

Very sad.

Per this chart, it's hardly the lowest-rated show -- it pulled in 99 out of 118 for the week from Dec. 2 and 8:

http://www.allyourtv.com/ratingsweekly.html

For the season so far per the same site, Firefly is 92 out of 112 (beating Dawson's Creek, Reba, Angel, The Parkers, Half and Half, That Was Then, Push Nevada, WB Wednesday movie, The Twilight Zone, Greetings from Tucson, Sabrina the Teenage Witch, What I Like About You, The Jamie Kennedy Experiment, Gilmore Girls Beginnings, Family Affair, Haunted, Do Over, UPN's Movie Friday, Angel (Sunday), and Off Centre).

Didn't know that Angel was doing so poorly as well. Maybe Joss isn't going to have too much pull at the WB after all...

Posted by: Vesper

quote:
Originally posted by TiVoOpsMgr
Didn't know that Angel was doing so poorly as well. Maybe Joss isn't going to have too much pull at the WB after all...

Coincidentally, Angel is also having problems due to its Timeslot. It's been on Sunday nights at 8pm (central) which put it up against Sopranos and Alias. It did much better last year on Monday nights. The WB is going to be moving it when it starts again after the first of the year. (To Wednesday, I believe.)

- Mike

Posted by: grecorj

I really wanted to like this show b/c of Whedon's pedigree. But it I found the first episode unwatchable. Oh well.

Posted by: jerobi

quote:
Originally posted by TiVoOpsMgr
http://www.allyourtv.com/ratingsweekly.html

Hey, I was looking for a decent ratings list that went deeper than the usual Top 20 or 50. Thanks, consider it bookmarked!

Posted by: ILoveMyTiVo

quote:
Originally posted by TiVoOpsMgr
Very sad.

Per this chart, it's hardly the lowest-rated show -- it pulled in 99 out of 118 for the week from Dec. 2 and 8:

You can't compare UPN/WB ratings to ratings on the other channel directly. They are in a whole separate league. At least part of the reason is that lots of people can't even receive WB and/or UPN, but I don't know if that is the major reason.

Notice that for the week, the highest rated WB or UPN show is #85 (WWE Smackdown), but FOX's highest show is #14. In fact, there are only 3 entries for FOX below UPN/WB's best rated show, and one of those was a movie, not a show. Every show under Firefly is on UPN or WB except for that one movie shown on FOX. That's BAD. I didn't realize the ratings were that bad.

(Of course the demagraphics breakdown matters too. And the season so far page on that site was too hard to read and didn't list the network, but from what I recognize, most of the shows you mention are WB/UPN or cancelled.)

I think there is still hope that WB or UPN will take it given they both have current deals with Joss and their ratings expectations are much lower. Buffy is considered a huge success (overall) even though it probably rarely makes the top 100 shows.

Posted by: jerobi

quote:
Originally posted by grecorj
I really wanted to like this show b/c of Whedon's pedigree. But it I found the first episode unwatchable. Oh well.

I was in the same boat...all that hype and it's a space western?!

But I decided to adopt my g/f's rule of giving a show four episodes to catch on. Okay, I admit it, she's crazy. I did give it a second chance though, and something made me stick around.

I think my favorite aspect is the "shock moment" in the last 5-10 minutes of most episodes...pushing people into engines, nearly killing a crewmate in an airlock to prove a point, punching a woman, etc...it's refreshing to see a little anti-hero now and then.

Posted by: Lori

I like a little anti in my hero. :)

Posted by: jerobi

#45 King of the Kill (7:40 p.m.)

Hmm...maybe Firefly just isn't Extreme enough for Fox after all. Add more chainsaws.

Posted by: ILoveMyTiVo

quote:
Originally posted by jerobi
[i]Hmm...maybe Firefly just isn't Extreme enough for Fox after all. Add more chainsaws.

You clearly haven't been watching recently. In the last 2 episodes,

Spoiler Alert! (highlight to read)
we've had torture scenes including cutting the main character's ear off and disturbing scenes of a bounty hunter threatening rape. Plenty of violence in this show.

Posted by: Maui

To all those who gave up after the first episode you missed some great TV. The first episode was probably the worst one they aired. Since then they have had several brilliant epsiodes.

Posted by: Opus

But it's Joss. :(

I am anxiously awaiting the Pilot (haven't seen it yet), and am convinced that it'll be very involving, though not enough Killin' for FOX. Thus shooting themselves in the foot again.

For God's sake, it's the best rated show on FOX in that timeslot! ;)

I can't believe that John Doe is their golden child on that night, silly show (but don't tell my wife I said that. She likes it).

Posted by: Torgo

Figures, the only new show this season I'm still watching , and is really growing on me, and they cancel it. *******s!
:confused:

Posted by: Maui

I just hope they can shop it to a station I can get without paying more for addtional cable channels.

Posted by: myriadian

yo,

i'm not a huge fan of 'firefly' but i do have an SP for it, but mostly because Gina Torres is so nice on the eyes and i like her acting.

she was in a few episodes of hercules, and was also in cleopatra 2525, and i think then started doing firefly...

i think that if it wasn't such a hokey 'space western' and Gina was the captain or at least had alot more airtime of her character and her husband then it would have done alot better.

more Gina and husband action, a shirtless bearded Jayne trying to get in with the doctor character and oh what a beautiful world it would have been.

M.

Posted by: dcheesi

quote:
Originally posted by Maui
To all those who gave up after the first episode you missed some great TV. The first episode was probably the worst one they aired. Since then they have had several brilliant epsiodes.

Hmm, the same thing happened to Lone Gunmen; though admittedly not masterpieces, the regular episodes were orders of magnitude better than the hacked together pilot script they aired first. So we can add bad first ep. to the list of ways Firefly was doomed from the start. Of course, I haven't seen the pilot yet, so I can't say whether this was Fox's fault or Joss'.

Posted by: ReenieS

quote:
Originally posted by Vesper
Coincidentally, Angel is also having problems due to its Timeslot. It's been on Sunday nights at 8pm (central) which put it up against Sopranos and Alias. It did much better last year on Monday nights. The WB is going to be moving it when it starts again after the first of the year. (To Wednesday, I believe.)

- Mike

Oh dear! I feel a head-to-head with "Law and Order" coming on....

Posted by: 12monkeys

I thought this was a very well down, pioneering show. ;)

IMHO, Enterprise should have been more like this.

"Gee, we are the first Earth ship, but was have this transporter technology."

Colonizing new places would not be glamorous, nor high tech. It would be expensive to haul any unneccesary cargo to new planets.

Let's see. First they have Dark Angel on Friday nights, and that gets cancelled. Then they put Firefly there. Anyone notice a pattern?

Posted by: Rob Helmerichs

quote:
Originally posted by ReenieS
Oh dear! I feel a head-to-head with "Law and Order" coming on....

The little networks only run shows at 7 & 8 Central...Angel is replacing Birds of Prey at 8.

Posted by: TiVoLance

from http://tv.zap2it.com/news/tvnewsdaily.html?29373

Whedon Searching for New 'Firefly' Home
Wed, Dec 18, 2002 05:35 PM PDT

LOS ANGELES (Zap2it.com) - FOX may have given up on "Firefly," but its creator hasn't.

The space-cowboys series was cancelled last week. But Whedon, the man behind "Buffy the Vampire Slayer" and "Angel" as well as "Firefly," is hopeful that someone else will want the show.

"First of all, I'm prouder of this show and the people I worked with on it than I can express in words, monkey noises, or hieroglyphics," Whedon writes in a posting on Buffistas.org, a fan site devoted to "Buffy" and the rest of Whedon's oeuvre.

Whedon says he believes "Firefly" has been "mistreated shamefully" -- by whom, he doesn't specify -- but thanks FOX for giving him a chance to shop the show around.

"Don't think for a second that I have given up on this show," he writes. "The FOX network has indicated that they would not stand in the way (which they can) of my finding a new home for the show. That's no easy prospect. But I will do everything in my power, as always, to keep this bird in the air."

The show ends its run on FOX Friday (Dec. 20) with a broadcast of the original two-hour pilot Whedon wrote. The pilot, which tells the story of how the crew of the ship Serenity came together, was scrapped after network executives asked for something with more action.

Three other episodes have finished shooting and will be completed, but their fate remains unclear. "Firefly," which aired at 8 p.m. Fridays, never built a sizable audience, drawing under 5 million viewers a week.

Saying "it ain't like I'm sleeping," Whedon signs off with a list of other cult favorites that lasted only a short time on FOX.

"For now, I proudly take my place beside 'Profit,' 'The Ben Stiller Show,' 'The Tick' and 'Action,' " he writes. "But I won't rest until I've found safe harbor (no, not the Gregory Harrison show) for this vessel."

Posted by: phone1

quote:
Originally posted by Hunter Green
Sure, we're techies with a heavy geek demographic slant and all that...

Speaking strictly for yourself of course. :D

I've bashed this show here before, but I never deleted the SP, so we caught up on it recently. I actually think it's better when they play down the hokey "Western" angle. The bounty hunter episode was pretty suspenseful.

I seem to recall that the pilot either hasn't been shown or was shown out of sequence. Does anyone know the production order vs the dates they were aired?

Posted by: TiVoPony

I hope someone picks this up.

It's a terrific show, our family is hooked.

Fox seems to have some of the best shows...and they cancel them regularly. :(

Pony

Posted by: ILoveMyTiVo

The pilot is going to be shown on 12/20. Here is a good site (for lots of shows) that shows production numbers (The pilot is called "Serenity" - no idea why the production number is 79): http://www.epguides.com/firefly/

Posted by: ronsch

quote:
Originally posted by TiVoPony
Fox seems to have some of the best shows...and they cancel them regularly. :(

Pony

It's hard to tell who's the best at this, FOX or ABC.

Posted by: Hunter Green

quote:
Originally posted by phone1
> Sure, we're techies with a heavy geek demographic slant and all that...
Speaking strictly for yourself of course. :D

I'm enough of a techie and geek to skew the TiVonaut collective demographics a fair amount by myself, yes. But I'm far from alone. ;)

Posted by: phone1

To all Firefly fans - from the TiVo Newsletter:

quote:

Welcome to Recommend It!, the latest addition to the TiVo Newsletter, where you pitch your favorite program in an effort to spread the good word on good TV that TiVo subscribers might be missing.

Send your recommendations to: recommendit@tivo.com

(Just kidding, Hunter. But I do love the way that propeller on your beanie spins faster when you get angry! :D )

Posted by: trojanrabbit

Somewhat OT but the latest TiVo newsletter's Recommend It! section has a blurb about the Save Farscape campaign.

Posted by: Harbingar

I love this show (Not as much as John Doe, but I love it)! Please save it!!

Posted by: sschwart

Let's hope that UPN or WB has the sense to scoop it up. In a better timeslot, I imagine it could pull in a few more points, and will grow in popularity over time.

-Steve

Posted by: boywaja

saw the following over in alt.tv.firefly. Doesn't leave me with a lot of hope that it will be picked up by another station.
_

Tim Minear wrote a message on the Buffistas board:

"Tim Minear - Dec 21, 2002 3:12:12 am EST

Well, I told you so. Yes I did.

And for those who are wondering if maybe we reworked the pilot -- for
certainly what you saw can't have been what Fox insisted was too "slow
and uninvolving," thereby putting the stink of failure on the show before
we ever had a chance to air an ep -- not so much. Joss added the battle
scene at the top of the ep, added one or two lines of clarification, but
by and large -- yep. That's what Fox didn't want us to air.

By-the-by... after Joss added the battle scenes and tightened throughout
and basically answered any problems the network could have had with
"Serenity"... from what I understand they never even looked at it. The
choice had been made. Stick it on a shelf. I think that was probably a
mistake.

What a strange week.

Two and half days into my eight day shoot (I was directing) for this last
episode, they cancelled us.

Joss and I were still writing the script. It had been our latest-latest.
One large reason for the not being finished: the not knowing. Made it
somewhat difficult to concentrate.

So I was, as is often my custom, making it up as I went along. Once the
other shoe dropped, it was almost a relief. I only mean that in the
torture-is-the-not-knowing sense -- after being treated so shabbily for
so long.

But we returned to work on friday, finished the scene we'd left dangling
the day before (we wrapped early the moment the news came down), and
somehow mushed through until today. Nathan came up to me that day after
and said, "I thought it would be really hard to get through today. But I
had so much fun." We all did.

Today was kind of a bummer. I finished shooting my episode yesterday. We
shot a gigantic flashback battle scene with Mal and Zoe. It was great
fun.

But today was a day for pick-ups and added scenes for episodes nearing
completion and some small reshoots. Part of that was pieces of a montage
for "Heart Of Gold." Alan, Sean, Summer and Jewel wrapped out yesterday
(at the end of the night I had one group shot of the entire cast walking
together. I finally got it after they quit goofing off for twenty
minutes, breaking the crew up as they did "model runway walks" complete
with turns and snaps. I have that on film. I knew it was likely the last
time the entire cast would be together in a frame of film. Maybe ever. So
that was kind of wonderful. And kind of sucked)

Morena, Gina, Ron, Adam and Nathan worked today. Anyway, one of the sets
was a small rebuild of a tiny portion of a larger set from the
aforementioned "Heart Of Gold." Each character had a shot or two for this
montage.

I brought in Gina, we shot her shot, then the AD announced, "that's a
"Firefly" wrap for Gina."

When an actor, usually a guest actor, finishes his or her last scene in
an episode, that is what happens. The AD (assistant director) announces,
"That's an episode wrap for so-and-so."

Doesn't happen with regulars.

But it did today.

Gina got a long and loving round of applause from the crew. She said many
warm and wonderful things. We hugged. She left.

Then I brought in Ron. Same thing. "That's a "Firefly" wrap for Ron
Glass." Ron couldn't speak at first. He finally said, "I didn't know it
could be like this." He thanked everyone and talked about what a special
experience this had been for him. We applauded some more. After many
hugs, Ron left. The AD called for "the next victim."

I was starting to hate this ugly little set. These unexpectedly generous,
grateful actors would come in to it, and that would be all. "That's a
"Firefly" wrap for Nathan." Nathan thanked everyone. For about the ten
millionth time.

Adam was brought onto the set. He lit a cigar, held up a gun. Smiled.
That was the shot. Adam's last shot. "That's a "Firefly" wrap for Adam
Baldwin." Adam thanked everyone. He said no one ever let him be funny
before. He was grateful for that. He said he was glad everyone seemed to
appreciate what a really exceptional experience our time had been. He was
glad that it wouldn't have to be regarded as such in retrospect, but that
the gratitude was of the present.

Adam and Nathan hung out until Morena shot her scene. Nobody wanted to
leave. "That's a "Firefly" wrap for Morena." She said it was the best job
she'd ever had. Not that she'd had a lot of jobs, she said. She doesn't
want it to be over. None of us do. Then I packed up my things. Shook
hands.

I drove off the lot. I got home. Turned on the TV. And they were finally
airing the pilot.

That's a "Firefly" wrap.

Posted by: Rob Helmerichs

Why doesn't it leave you with hope that it will be picked up by another network? That's all about Fox.

As long as Whedon says there's still hope, there's still hope...and Whedon says there's still hope (albeit not a ton).

Posted by: minorthr

Hopefully it will get picked up, maybe WB UPN or Scifi. Fox is always canceling their good shows. I wish someone would also pick up the family guy as well. That was a great show

Posted by: ResidentLunatic

Okay, here's my take on some things.

We watched the "first" episode of "Firefly", The Train Job. We weren't that impressed, because it lacked, well, substance. I tend to give new shows 5 or 6 episodes prior to passing final judgement -- if they last that long anymore -- so we moved on and watched several other shows we'd been saving for far too long, all the while storing up the entire season of Firefly on my primary TiVo. Ahhh. :)

Bored one night, I sat down and reordered my Now Showing alphabetically, and then accidentally watched the fifth episode, Out of Gas. I liked it! It was good! Figuring it was the second episode, I thought it was a cool way to "flash back" and give us some of the missing background.

Then I realized I watched them out of order. Oops. :) With my wife still disinterested, I watched the rest of season over the course of a few days. Around episode 7, she began watching from the start.

So, ten episodes down, I hear Fox will air the real pilot, Serenity. What? Can someone explain the reasoning behind this massively stupid broadcast order? Was something in it too forward for Fox? Maybe they didn't want to invest two hours on a premiere? Anyone?

The pilot was wonderful! Of course, I knew the results of most plot points as the episode went on, having just seen the first ten episodes, but the episode really set up the show well. It answered many of my questions from the other ten. Character development to underlying plot to the wonderfully accurate attention to detail (there's no sound in a vacuum, i.e., space ... thank you!).

My wife had only seen the first two episodes when she watched the pilot, so she actually gets to watch the series in pretty much the intended order. Lucky her!

So, after dealing with SciFi's dismal decision to can Farscape, we're now upset that Fox will drop "Firefly", while "Last Chance Tuesday" lineup (kudos to SNL) continues to exist on ABC.

Oh, and ABC wins the "Brilliant But Cancelled" Award (thanks, Trio), killing off "Sports Night", "Cupid" and the new "Fantasy Island" without flinching.

But Fox follows closely with "Futurama" and "Firefly". Argh.

My $.02.

-- RL

Posted by: stevel

According to a discussion in Slashdot, a DVD set of Firefly does indeed appear to be in the works = 16:9 widescreen for all episodes plus extras.

Posted by: DanT

A discussion on slashdot based on the rumor at Ain't It Cool News. While I'm sure they're coming, the /. "news" isn't anything new. People are acting like it's an official announcement or something.

Posted by: Hunter Green

There was another citation that put it in USA Today -- which is hardly a bastion of credibility, but even USA Today ranks above /. on the credibility scale. Not much, but a little.

Posted by: HTH

Didn't USA Today republish a story from The Onion once? (Actually, haven't several (reputable) publishers done that at least once at various times?)

Posted by: sieglinde

A Chinese newspaper took an article in the Onion that had us replacing the Capital building in Washington DC as gospel. (I can see Al Jazeera doing it, but they haven't.)