Registered: Mar 2001
Location: Roseville, CA
Posts: 7

The BIGGEST downside of using a stacker in the above mentioned designs is that you will need 2 de-stackers and a splitter at EACH DTiVo. Also, using the stacker/de-stacker combo will not work for the Oval Dishes/HDTV.

# Matt

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Philips 14hr (+60 GB) on 2.0.1
Philips 14hr (+40 GB) on 2.0.1
Philips 14hr on 2.0.1

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Registered: May 2001
Location: Castaic, Ca., USA
Posts: 0

Agreed, but if you have no choice (cable cannot be run) - this is the only hope you have for dual tuners. At the cost of buying destackers, there is room for a "4 pack" discount from the reseller.

TiMo

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DirecTV since 9/1997
DirecTiVo since 3/2001

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Registered: Jul 2001
Location: Minneapolis, MN
Posts: 4

So what would be considered a reasonable price for the equipment to have two tuners on one line? I am expecting a quote today and would like to have a reference. As well, how is the quality?

And why is it that this scheme doesn't work with the wide dish? You can't stack four times for the extra transponders? That would make sense to me. I really don't have a need for HDTV, Spanish channels, and NASA.

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Registered: May 2001
Location: Castaic, Ca., USA
Posts: 0

I would expect a price above $200 for all the parts, but it should be well below $300. If they do the labor for you, then it would be higher.

And you are correct about the Dual/Dual LNB - you simply can't multiplex that much onto one cable (at least for now). If you don't need the few things missing, then you won't have any problems.

Hope it works out well for you, keep us updated,

TiMo

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DirecTV since 9/1997
DirecTiVo since 3/2001

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Registered: Jul 2001
Location: Minneapolis, MN
Posts: 4

Well, I received the quote. It consisted of:

1-Stacked LNBF Dish
2-Sub units for splitting the signal
2-High frequency line splitters
1-Line Amplifier
1-SAT-T60 Receiver

All for the low low price of $1213.

Told me they were quoting the receiver alone at $649. Too bad I just bought it at lunch for $399 minus the $100 rebate.

Seems to me they quoted so high so they don't have to do the install based on the estimate given here. I guess it's lines on the outside for me...

[This message has been edited by smptc73 (edited 07-17-2001).]

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Registered: Sep 2000
Location: Pleasanton, CA
Posts: 68

Any new information regarding this setup?

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Registered: Dec 1999
Location:
Posts: 748

Any news on this of late? I am realizing it is spending a lot on cables and amps or getting a solution like this to work.

Mark

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Registered: Aug 2001
Location:
Posts: 8

quote:

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Originally posted by Otto:
To run both feeds over a single wire is not possible using a diplexer. However, you can do it using a wideband device. I don't know much about these, but they are designed to let you run both LNBs on one wire. It'll probably be expensive though, I'd look harder into running a second cable.

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Registered: Feb 2001
Location: Vienna, VA
Posts: 292

Isn't that just for combining two different dishes into one line? How would you split this back into two feeds at the DTivo end?

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Spoon!

[This message has been edited by vman (edited 08-23-2001).]

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Registered: May 2001
Location: Castaic, Ca., USA
Posts: 0

Javo,

The devices at that link are for combining and splitting OTA signal with 1 LNB polarity. The LNB polarity requested by the receiver is then "switched" to the appropriate LNB (via seperate LNB inputs). These devices do not allow you to have TWO LNB polarities on one cable. That's what the more expensive stacker/destacker kits do for you.

UPDATE:
Friday we will find out when the prototype "personal edition" stackers will be available for testing. Once the "personal" units are done, the problem is solved by either doing one of the following:
1) run both LNB signals into a multi-switch
2) run two of the multi-switch outputs into the personal stacker
3) run the stacked signal to the room with the DirecTiVo
4) split the stacked signal coming out of the wall
5) attach each split to a SEPERATE destacker
6) attach each discreet signal to distinct inputs on the DirecTiVo

or

1) run both LNB signals into the "personal" stacker
2) split the stacked signal to all rooms with DSS receivers
-- use a destacker for all single input DSS receivers
3) run one split of the stacked signal to the room with the DirecTiVo
4) split the stacked signal coming out of the wall
5) attach each split to a SEPERATE destacker
6) attach each discreet signal to distinct inputs on the DirecTiVo

I will let you know how the prototype works out.

TiMo

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DirecTV since 9/1997
DirecTiVo since 3/2001

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Registered: Jul 2001
Location: Stamford, CT
Posts: 66

I have the oval dish, and I think I understand from reading this thread that I'm SOL for using upconverters and downcoverters to get a second line for my DTiVo?


Also, I'm in the process of convincing a buddy to get a DTiVo, and he won't be able to run a line for his second tuner. I'm new to DTiVo myself, so I'm being a little slow and would appreciate some help.

My friend has the round dish with dual LNB's. He has one line to his living room and one to his bedroom. Do you use the upconverter/downconverter just before the receiver to split the one line into two lines?

Why can't you just use the one line coming into his living room and use a multiplexer to get two lines out of it? I understand you can't use a regular RF splitter, but this stuff is a little beyond me. Any help would be appreciated!

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Registered: May 2001
Location: Castaic, Ca., USA
Posts: 0

I do not believe that combining the 4 discreet signals onto one cable is possible with available technology.

"My friend has the round dish with dual LNB's. He has one line to his living room and one to his bedroom. Do you use the upconverter/downconverter just before the receiver to split the one line into two lines?"

There are TWO ways to do this:
1) use a multi-switch first (plug both LNB's into the switch)
2) use one separate output of the multi-switch for each regular DSS receiver
3) use two separate outputs for the stacker
4) run the new stacked cable to the room with DirecTiVo
5) split the cable in the room and use TWO destackers to get both inputs

or

1) plug both LNB's directly into the stacker
2) split the stacked cable to each room
3) use one destacker for EACH regular DSS receiver
4) use a splitter in the room with the DirecTiVo
5) use TWO destackers to connect discreet inputs to the DirecTiVo

The reason you need two destackers after you split the wire is in case each tuner is tuning to a DIFFERENT polarity. If both are using the same polarity, the destackers will "unstack" the same signal. This would be a "random" event, as most people have no idea what channel is on what polarity (nor do we really care).

"Why can't you just use the one line coming into his living room and use a multiplexer to get two lines out of it? I understand you can't use a regular RF splitter, but this stuff is a little beyond me. Any help would be appreciated!"

Essentially that is what a stacker/destacker does. You stack the two polarities onto one cable. Then you split the cable and use two destackers. Each destacker can access EITHER of the two polarities at any given time. The net result is two cables going into two tuners that can tune in all channels with only one wire from room to post.

TiMo


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DirecTV since 9/1997
DirecTiVo since 3/2001

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Registered: Aug 2001
Location:
Posts: 8

quote:

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Originally posted by TiMo:
Javo,

The devices at that link are for combining and splitting OTA signal with 1 LNB polarity. The LNB polarity requested by the receiver is then "switched" to the appropriate LNB (via seperate LNB inputs). These devices do not allow you to have TWO LNB polarities on one cable. That's what the more expensive stacker/destacker kits do for you.

---

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Registered: Aug 2001
Location:
Posts: 8

I'm done with stackers (I'm going to pull some wire this weekend), but for those that aren't and think that they know how its used, the following link sells them for $28.
http://www.northamericancable.com/pr01.htm

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Registered: Aug 2001
Location:
Posts: 8

Oh yah, I take back everything I have ever said on stackers.
The following are my last words on the subject from another thread:

First a quote by someone that knows how stackers are used --"An ingenious way of getting around polarity switching problems has been to install a dual polarity feedhorn/LNB or dual LNBF system, and then connecting a combiner and converter device known as the SFE-350. PRIMESTAR 2-port LNBFs are fixed horizontal and vertical, rather than 14/18 volt LNBF logic, so they work perfectly in this application. So will an inexpensive dual port feedhorn for C-band, and a pair of LNBs, in proximity with the SFE-350 device. Those wanting full availability of both LEFT and RIGHT-HAND Circular signals on international satellites such as NSS-806 at 40.5 West might also consider this device, after connecting an ADL CPOR-100 dual circular feedhorn and 2 LNBs in place. Everything will travel down one wire, with no need to worry about polarity selection. The first polarity is powered and transferred from the normal 950 to 1450 MHz. The second polarity normally runs at the same frequencies, but is converted by the SFE-350 device to 1525 to 2025 MHz, and is stacked on top of the first batch of frequencies. All you need to do is tune the proper frequency with your MPEG-2 receiver. Standalone receivers using LNBF logic can get the optional SFE-450 downconverter, which uses 14/18 volt switching and provides a switched converted output that accesses both signals for use in a "normal" receiver. Such is the logic used by STAR CHOICE and others with Stacked LNBFs from California Amplifier."

Second a quote from someone that though he knew, then thought he didn't, then thought he did.... --- "Most of the discussion here assumes that a stacker can be used to combine two outputs from a multi switch onto one wire. It seems to me that an output from a multi switch only has one polarity or the other fed to it at a time (isn't that that the whole function of the switch to hold each LNB on a signle polarity and then feed one or the other to a receiver depending on which polarity was requested?)depending on which polarity is called for the receiver's square wave generator. The first time I saw one of these up converters I thought it needed both signals fed into it at once and so that it could only be wired in at the dual LNB, not after a multi switch. But then I started to wonder if I was wrong because everyone on these pages seem convinced that it can be wired in after a multi switch (where, like I said, there is never two polarity signals at the same time). So I repeat my question, has anyone ever done this and if so what happened?"

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Registered: May 2001
Location: Castaic, Ca., USA
Posts: 0

Holland Electronics just released there brand new "MicroStacker" for smaller applications. It was designed with the DirecTiVo/UTV product in mind, and uses the standard H.E. destackers. You can call H.E. for a list of distributors in your area to get the products. Here is what you need for a basic dual tuner/single cable setup:

Holland Electronics
1x - MicroStacker (6db gain, power inserter)
Part #US575-T

2x - DeStacker
Part #D575

1x - High Freq. splitter
Part #HRS2

HOWEVER: You can have as many tuners/receivers as you want on a single cable by using DeStackers - so at times it may be more flexible to use DeStackers than multiswitches, but that's not always the case. The two products, multiswitches and stacker/destackers, are compatible and can be used together where it makes sense.

Expect pricing of $250 to $300 for the total solution, but that's an estimate, at retail. You can probably negotiate better.

Call Dave Ward @ Holland Electronics and request the name of a distributor in your area ... they do not sell directly to end users. (805) 339-9060

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DirecTV since 9/1997
DirecTiVo since 3/2001

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Registered: Sep 2000
Location: Pleasanton, CA
Posts: 68

Just spoke to Dave at Holland. Nice guy. He told me what I'll need and is getting me a distributor close to me. He even has a website on the side.

Here's his page: www.wiredathome.com

As soon as I get the distributor info, I'll be ordering it.

I'll let you know how it goes..

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Registered: Not Yet
Location:
Posts: N/A

It looks like Dave is selling kits on his site: http://www.wiredathome.com/stacksat.htm

I'm curious how a diplexer can fit into this scenario. Is it possible to combine a stacked signal and a CATV signal down a single RG-6 cable?

Can anyone shed some light on this? Thanks.

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Registered: Sep 2000
Location: Pleasanton, CA
Posts: 68

quote:

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Originally posted by ahawthorn:
It looks like Dave is selling kits on his site: http://www.wiredathome.com/stacksat.htm

I'm curious how a diplexer can fit into this scenario. Is it possible to combine a stacked signal and a CATV signal down a single RG-6 cable?

Can anyone shed some light on this? Thanks.

---

The diplexer would go after the stacked signal. I have a cable modem signal going with my stacked signal to an outlet in the house. I believe a CATV signal is below 950 MHz so that shouldn't be a problem.

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Sony T-60 35 hr (Dual Drive)
2 Philips DSR6000R 35 hr(1 Single drive and 1 Dual Drive)

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Registered: Mar 2002
Location: Portland, OR
Posts: 35

What's the latest on this subject? Has anyone implemented a system like this?

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