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>>> Which Drive Is Best... <<<
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03-07-2004 01:03 PM

ahhfoo
Member

Registered: Jan 2002
Location: Mass
Posts: 54

Which Drive Is Best...

While I am sure this has been asked an answered in the past, I figure with the speed things change, it is prudent to ask it here and now... I have been reading around on the upgrade drives to get and have come to the conclusion that I know nothing more than I did when I started... So if anyone has any good info (or bad), I sure could use it...

The problem I have is that I am torn between what I see now and what I thought I knew... Before, drives were best if they spun at 5400 to keep down the heat... Now, with the FDB Maxtors, it seems that might be a thing of the past... Then again, Maxtor also makes some FDB 5400 drives so the 7200 might not be best for the task... In all, the one thing I know about my Tivo unit (Hughes GXCEBOT) is that the biggest, best or most advanced hardware is not necessarily the best thing for it... The unit seems more in tune with the slower or less advances components and I guess that is really the beauty of it all... How Tivo does what it does is beyond me but with this choice to make now, I want to get it right... In the end, my biggest problem with the question at hand is that the 2 most trusted sources (Hinsdale and Weakness) offers completely different concepts... Hinsdale offers the 7200 newer Ultra Series FDB drives and Weakness offers the older Diamond Max 16 drives... Given that I am going to go with 2 drives this time around, I really could use a word or 2 on why to get each or either...

Thanks in advance...

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03-07-2004 02:57 PM

dahacker
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Registered: Jan 2004
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No one is going to add any real information to the many threads on this subject.

Weakness has a blurb on their site about the drive they use:

http://www.weaknees.com/maxtor_quickview.php

Problem is, as far as I know, the end user can't buy these directly.

But personally, I would stop thinking about it and just get the most affordable, quietest drive, with the longest warranty and be done with it. What met these requirements for me was the Samsung drives.

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03-07-2004 03:07 PM

ahhfoo
Member

Registered: Jan 2002
Location: Mass
Posts: 54

The Maxtor drives weakness sells are just the DiamondMax 16 drive and they are available... Major places don't stock them because they are all but obsolete for PC's but there is nothing unique about their availability... They are being discontinued however so that may make them harder to get... The concern for me is really more in the buffers... The 5400 has a 2mb buffer and the 7200 has an 8mb buffer and I really don't know which the Tivo would prefer... It almost seems that the Tivo hardware would rather get the stream slower than faster in order to better manage it...

In the end, what I would really like to hear here is success or failure stories with these 2 types of Maxtor drives... The FDB motor for me is pretty much a lock right now so it is only a matter of the 2 or 8 mb buffer and the 5400 or 7200 spin... Hopefully, someone will be able to help me with that...

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03-07-2004 03:19 PM

dahacker
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Registered: Jan 2004
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But personally, I would stop thinking about it and just get the most affordable, quietest drive, with the longest warranty and be done with it. What met these requirements for me was the Samsung drives.

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03-07-2004 03:34 PM

weaknees
TiVo Forum Special Member

Registered: May 2001
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 3155

Actually, the Maxtor QuickView drives we use have some parts in common with standard desktop DiamondMax drives, but have a different TLA (top level assembly) that makes them stream video better, run cooler, and make less noise. They aren't being phased out, in fact, Maxtor says their sales of these drives are growing.

Michael

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03-07-2004 06:00 PM

ahhfoo
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Registered: Jan 2002
Location: Mass
Posts: 54

I stand corrected... That is exactly the kinda info I need... On the Maxtor sight they are showing the Quick View drives as the DiamondMax 16 but if you have some special application being made, that is even better... They promote the DiamondMax as for streaming video and like applications but if yours are even better, then there is the reason I would want one... I tape about 6 hours per day, every day so need a good working unit that will last... I am running a Western Digital now but it is the last of the 5400's as near as I can tell... It has performed perfect for 2 years now but I am concerned with the high heat that is it time to do it again...

As far as the discontinued note is concerned, that I got from alot of the retailers web sites... They are reporting the 120 is discontinued but that is no reliable source so I think you would be the better one to trust with that... Gonna go take another look at the prices of the finished drives but sure would like the raw ones to save my recordings... Thinking 2 120's or 2 160's is the way to go while I am taking the time to do it right...

On the Samsung, I have no experience... I have bought only Western Digital drives for about 8 years now (PC and TIVO) and love them to death... As far as I can tell however, the Maxtor seems to have the edge with the FDB for the high stress and high heat environment of the Tivo unit... Right now, I am kinda set on Maxtor and gonna go read up on both the Hinsdale and weakness drives one more time... Weakness offers a new fan rig too and I think it is better to be safe than sorry...

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03-07-2004 06:05 PM

ThreeSoFar
FourNowActually

Registered: May 2002
Location: Baltimore
Posts: 2708

Heard many bad things about WD drives, though obviously not your personal experience. I've never used them.

Have used Maxtors and Samsungs and have no problems with either. Samsung is cheaper pre-rebate, by far, and I hate rebate hassles. Samsungs seem quieter, too.

Could have sworn one of the sites on here (Maybe Robert S?) said they used Samsungs, exclusively. But that was whenever....who knows now.

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I think ThreeSoFar's advice is by far the best...gregpr

Four TiVos now, all with single Samsung drives:
Humax DRT800 w/DVD-R (174hrs)
Two older Series 2's (142hrs and 157hrs),and a newer nightlight
Series 2, a stupid case design IMO (174hrs)
All but the last are lifetimed. TiVite since 2000. There is a Good IR solution.

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03-07-2004 06:17 PM

ahhfoo
Member

Registered: Jan 2002
Location: Mass
Posts: 54

I have owned about 6 or 8 WD drives for the PC and 1 for the Tivo and they have all run flawlessly... The Tivo 160 running now has gotten about 6 hours per day of taped time and runs dual tuners so is always running all out... I really feared any drive could not take that but it has... I am running 74mb Raptor (SATA) now in my PC and it is the fastest drive I have ever seen (4.5 ms at)... Never heard anything about them Tivo wise, just went with what I knew... In hindsight now however, I can assure you it has worked like a dream... No noise, no delays and no problems... Gonna go Maxtor this time cause I figure Hinsdale and Weakness know more than I ever will... I assume Samsung is a fine product too but want to play the best odds so it will surely be a Maxtor on this trip...

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03-07-2004 07:35 PM

tivoupgrade
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quote:
Originally posted by ahhfoo
I have owned about 6 or 8 WD drives for the PC and 1 for the Tivo and they have all run flawlessly... The Tivo 160 running now has gotten about 6 hours per day of taped time and runs dual tuners so is always running all out... I really feared any drive could not take that but it has... I am running 74mb Raptor (SATA) now in my PC and it is the fastest drive I have ever seen (4.5 ms at)... Never heard anything about them Tivo wise, just went with what I knew... In hindsight now however, I can assure you it has worked like a dream... No noise, no delays and no problems... Gonna go Maxtor this time cause I figure Hinsdale and Weakness know more than I ever will... I assume Samsung is a fine product too but want to play the best odds so it will surely be a Maxtor on this trip...

Nothing wrong with Samsung either - and note there are folks who've been around here even longer than Hinsdale and Weakness who do vouch for the Samsungs, as well as Maxtor and Western Digital Drives. If you are looking to play the odds - bet on the supplier of your drives, not necessarily the manufacturer - poor shipping and handling are bigger contributors to a drive's early demise than any difference in any of these drives' characteristics.

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03-07-2004 08:22 PM

ThreeSoFar
FourNowActually

Registered: May 2002
Location: Baltimore
Posts: 2708

quote:
Originally posted by tivoupgrade
Nothing wrong with Samsung either - and note there are folks who've been around here even longer than Hinsdale and Weakness who do vouch for the Samsungs, as well as Maxtor and Western Digital Drives. If you are looking to play the odds - bet on the supplier of your drives, not necessarily the manufacturer - poor shipping and handling are bigger contributors to a drive's early demise than any difference in any of these drives' characteristics.

Right, but if that Mfr. has a good warranty, the cost savings at these vendors are worth (IMO) the higher risk of having to use that warranty down the line.

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03-07-2004 10:16 PM

ahhfoo
Member

Registered: Jan 2002
Location: Mass
Posts: 54

Just a follow up on the Quick View / DiamondMax 16 issue... I tried to get the details on both to know which is which but found that they are even the same mfg part number of 4R120L0... I have written them to get the differences detailed... I have also not seen the drives for sale anywhere online... Have seen a couple under that part number but they are all being advertised as 7200 spins so I am getting more lost by the minute...

The Samsung I have researched a bit too and the general image I am getting is that they are pretty nice too... High buyer ratings and as Martha would say (probably not now) "that's a good thing"...

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03-07-2004 10:47 PM

tivoupgrade
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quote:
Originally posted by ahhfoo
Just a follow up on the Quick View / DiamondMax 16 issue... I tried to get the details on both to know which is which but found that they are even the same mfg part number of 4R120L0... I have written them to get the differences detailed... I have also not seen the drives for sale anywhere online... Have seen a couple under that part number but they are all being advertised as 7200 spins so I am getting more lost by the minute...

The Samsung I have researched a bit too and the general image I am getting is that they are pretty nice too... High buyer ratings and as Martha would say (probably not now) "that's a good thing"...

The Samsung drives are great - and they have a 3-year warranty, as well. The Maxtor 120GB drives are all 1-year warranty. You have the right part number for the Maxtor (at least that is the same number our distributor has given us; it is a 5400RPM drive).

As far as I know you can only get the Maxtor through a distributor, not a retailer.

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03-08-2004 12:56 AM

ThreeSoFar
FourNowActually

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Posts: 2708

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03-08-2004 01:09 AM

Devg
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Registered: Feb 2004
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I am stuck considering either a Maxtor or Seagate drive. The nice thing about maxtor is that it's the brand tivo uses (which has to mean they like it). Maybe im wrong...im so stuck with my decision right now

I did notice though that I can not find any 5400 120GB drives anymore. Does anyone know of a place that sells any? I am looking at a Seagate or Maxtor (not sure yet im stuck!) 120GB but it is 7200. I hope the 7200 is not an issue (noise, drive life, heat)

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03-08-2004 01:57 AM

tivoupgrade
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Registered: Sep 2000
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quote:
Originally posted by Devg
I am stuck considering either a Maxtor or Seagate drive. The nice thing about maxtor is that it's the brand tivo uses (which has to mean they like it). Maybe im wrong...im so stuck with my decision right now

I did notice though that I can not find any 5400 120GB drives anymore. Does anyone know of a place that sells any? I am looking at a Seagate or Maxtor (not sure yet im stuck!) 120GB but it is 7200. I hope the 7200 is not an issue (noise, drive life, heat)

7200RPM is not going to be a problem; it hasn't been a serious concern for the past several years (about 4 years ago, many 7200RPM drives ran significantly hotter, and somewhat noisier - this was a concern in the Series1 DirecTiVo due to limited airflow).

Maxtor is A brand that TiVo uses. Many TiVo system also contain Western Digital drives, and older Quantum drives (Quantum was acquired by Maxtor a couple of years ago). As far as brands are concerned, Seagate is known to be a bit more of a 'premium' brand.

I'll reiterate - for the most part, the comparison among drives for this application is splitting hairs - its not going to make a huge difference - the chance of you getting a bad drive is more dependent upon "luck" unless you choose one from a vendor who mishandles or ships the drive in a less-than-appropriate mailer (newegg has had a reputation for poor packing materials, for example).

Personally, I run dual Samsung 120GB 7200RPM drives in my Series1 DirecTV unit; no issues. Samsung is our current preferred brand due to their high quality, three year warranty and competitively priced drives.

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03-08-2004 02:11 PM

ahhfoo
Member

Registered: Jan 2002
Location: Mass
Posts: 54

One more follow up... Maxtor just wrote me back stating that the Quick View drives and the DiamondMax 16 drive are one in the same... Not sure how or why but they said no differences at all hence the same part number on both...

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03-08-2004 02:15 PM

dahacker
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Registered: Jan 2004
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Posts: 151

I would stop thinking about it and just get the most affordable, quietest drive, with the longest warranty and be done with it.

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03-08-2004 03:31 PM

ahhfoo
Member

Registered: Jan 2002
Location: Mass
Posts: 54

You are right there... Tired of looking myself... With all that I have learned and all that I have read I decided to go with the Samsungs... The customer reviews were really undeniable because the drive was either dead on arrival from shipping or performed wonderfully... The only less than good thing I read was that they are not as fast as some but given that speed is not really the biggest issue (my current old 5400 runs fast even when my Tivo is full and taping 2 shows) they really do look like the best bet...

Got this one...

http://www.samsung.com/Products/Har...ies_SP1213N.htm

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03-08-2004 03:37 PM

tivoupgrade
PTVupgrade, Sponsor

Registered: Sep 2000
Location: Chicago, IL USA
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quote:
Originally posted by ahhfoo
You are right there... Tired of looking myself... With all that I have learned and all that I have read I decided to go with the Samsungs... The customer reviews were really undeniable because the drive was either dead on arrival from shipping or performed wonderfully... The only less than good thing I read was that they are not as fast as some but given that speed is not really the biggest issue (my current old 5400 runs fast even when my Tivo is full and taping 2 shows) they really do look like the best bet...

Got this one...

http://www.samsung.com/Products/Har...ies_SP1213N.htm

Good choice. Note, drive-speed is not an issue at all (except in very specific cases) when it comes to TiVo performance. 1-2MB/sec is all that is needed from a hard drive in a TiVo system and ALL desktop hard drives provide significantly greater performance than that; IE the bottleneck to system performance in a TiVo is not the drive's I/O...

Lj

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03-08-2004 03:44 PM

Chris Gerhard
TiVo Forum Special Member

Registered: Apr 2002
Location: MO
Posts: 2929

quote:
Originally posted by Devg
I am stuck considering either a Maxtor or Seagate drive. The nice thing about maxtor is that it's the brand tivo uses (which has to mean they like it). Maybe im wrong...im so stuck with my decision right now

For the same price I would buy Seagate but I would not pay much more for it. My personal preference is to buy any brand with a 3-year warranty, again provided the price differential is not a factor. The Samsung 5400rpm with a 3-year warranty is great in my opinion. Drives with a 3-year warranty for our TiVos are much harder to find now.

Chris

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