Registered: Mar 2003
Location:
Posts: 14

Upgrade Power & heat issues

I've been trying to find heat and power related posts all over the boards. It occurs to me that this is an important enough subject that there should be a dedicated thread for it.

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MosleyH

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Registered: Mar 2003
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Posts: 14

Cool Sat?

I'm curious about the various strategies being employed to add cooling to tivos.

I'm getting ready to drop 2 120 Gb Seagate Barracuda 7200 rpm drives in my series 2, and so am very concerned about heat. It's running at 36 degrees with 2 5400 rpm (whiny) 100Gb maxtors, so the comparison should be interesting.

I saw a thing called Cool Sat over at smarthome.com. It's basically a box designed to sit under a satellite receiver. It has a large fan in its center directed up, with weatherstripping to make a seal with the bottom of the receiver's case. It has it's own power supply, so no additional drain on the tivo's. I suppose you could make it suck or blow, based on your needs.

Has anyone tried such as this with a tivo?

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MosleyH

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Registered: Aug 2000
Location: Nashua, NH
Posts: 7476

The "Cool Sat" wouldn't work with a TiVo - it's designed for boxes that have vents on the top of the box. This device would make a TiVo overheat in a short time, since the airflow would be sealed off.

I have a Seagate Barracuda V 120GB and Maxtor Plus 9 120GB in my main DTiVo. The temps didn't change at all from before.

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Steve

One thousand three hundred thirty-three, zero

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Registered: Mar 2003
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Good point. Thanks.

Although, I suppose as a last resort prior to meltdown, you could (theoretically) ventilate the Tivo's case in the appropriate spots, and then the "Cool Sat" might work.

I'm hoping not to have to find out though. . .

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MosleyH

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Registered: Sep 2001
Location: Tallahassee, FL, USA
Posts: 811

I've had two 120GB WD drives in my SA TiVo since Christmas and now that the weather is starting to get warmer, but not so warm as to run the a/c all day, I've been monitoring the temp closely. I've seen it as high as 41 so far. I may end having to run the a/c all day a little sooner than I normally would.

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Registered: Sep 2001
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Posts: 29

as high as 41? what I wouldn't pay... :-)

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Registered: Sep 2001
Location: Tallahassee, FL, USA
Posts: 811

Yeah, but that is a little high for a SA. I've seen it as low as 36 when I turn the heat off during the day in winter.

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Registered: Mar 2003
Location: Charleston, SC area
Posts: 25

My S2 has never been lower then 39 and generaly reaches highs of 44. I am worried about this and since it sits in a cabinet have taken the following steps (to no avail); unit is raised 1" off the glass shelf and back of cabinett has two large vents installed to allow heat to leave the cabinet. In this cabinet only Tivo is a heat sorce. Don't know what else to do.

PS: This unit has no mods in it. It is original.

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Registered: Mar 2002
Location: Westchester, NY
Posts: 938

Lsinger, I don't know that 44C is such a big worry, but you could install a small fan to blow air out of the back of your cabinet.

I use an ordinary surplus 12V fan that I pulled out of an old PC. I drive it at 4.5Volts with a Radio Shack AC adapter/battery eliminator. This runs it slow and quiet. Just keeps the air moving enough. The voltage is selectable from 1.5 to 12volts, so I "tuned" the setup - trading off noise against coolth.

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Registered: Dec 2001
Location: Morgan Hill, CA
Posts: 1651

I would give me first born child for temps in the 39-44 range. Do not worry, I have been running at around 48-50 on my unmodified unit for almost two years with not the slightest problem. My other unit was running 50-57 without any problems, until recently, I installed a fan and got it down to 48-50

T

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1 Unmodified Hughes DirecTivo, 2 Unmodified HDVR2's

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Registered: Mar 2002
Location: Westchester, NY
Posts: 938

Tonyoci, 48-50C is "normal" for DirecTIVO (1st generation) -
you can get them a bit cooler with mods, but otherwise they regulate their own temperature (by varying the fan voltage) and always warm up to at least 48C.

S2 Tivos are different beasties that typically report lower temps.

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Registered: Jan 2000
Location: Denver, CO
Posts: 1290

My S1 DTiVo is much happier and cooler since I upgraded. Before it ran in the mid to lower 50s and now in the mid to upper 30s and it was cheap.

While replacing the stock 15 & 30GB drives with dual 5400 80s I did the following (now it has 120GB and 80GB):

- Jumpered stock fan to run at 12V (instead of the 7V on the motherboard) - jumper was under $4 shipped, does add some fan noise
- Taped the bulkhead inside the unit to seal any air leaks
- Added a thin strip of foam to the top of the bulkhead to seal gap when cover is on
- Raised unit up - originally on overturned 20oz plastic bottle caps ($4 at our vending machine at work) - now on Duplos until I drink some more Fruitopia (I lost the original caps)
- Put a cross flow air blocker under unit to stop the cool air inlet on the bottom left of unit sucking air in from the hot air exhaust on the bottom left - a sheet of paper folded into a V shape. Approx $.01 unless you grab one from the recycle bin
- 40mm fan running at 7V sucking air in on the cool side. Not much good since it makes too much noise at 12v (I drilled holes instead of going with a grill), but I leave it hooked up since its already there.

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Registered: Mar 2003
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Posts: 14

If I have to go that way, I've been eyeing some "magnetic levitation" fans at cyberguys.com:

"Our state-of-the-art multi-purpose cooling fans actually use magnetic levitation to "float" the spinning fan blade in a magnetic field to dramatically reduce friction, wear, & heat... making these fans run cooler, quieter and last longer than conventional fans! Ideal for use in any mission application, in applications where minimal fan noise is desired, or where access to fan installation or replacement is difficult. • Virtually friction-free while running"

They're around $11 each

I hope not to have to go there, but you folks that need fans might find them useful. . .

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MosleyH

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Registered: Aug 2000
Location: Nashua, NH
Posts: 7476

Don't bother with the "magnetic levitation" fans. I ordered two from Cyberguys and sent them back - they're loud. The leader in fans so far for me has been ADDA.

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Steve

One thousand three hundred thirty-three, zero

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Registered: Sep 2002
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Instant temp reduction for S2-60's

There is a way to reduce the temperature of Series 2 - 60 hour units with no cost and almost zero effort:

Stand the unit on its left edge (left as viewed from the front).

The S2-60 "inhales" air through vents at the left edge of the bottom of the case. Hot air is exhausted through a matching set of holes on the right edge of the bottom.

When you place the unit on its left edge, the natural convection seems to increase airflow through the unit (cool air in at the bottom, hot air out at the top).

I had a S2-60 set this way for a few days and it ran at 38C. When I moved it to a horizontal position, the temperature jumped to 45C. When I put it in its final position in a closed-back rack, the temp went to 50C.

This may work for other models... As long as you can create a "Cool in at the bottom, hot out at the top" configuration.

Me? Unfortunately, I had to keep the hardware in the rack so I have holes punched in the back of the rack, exhaust fans, air dams etc. With all this effort I still only get 41-43C. 38C looks pretty good, but I can't install vertically. If your installation allows for a verical orientation, it's worth a try!

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Series 2, 302 Hours (Maxtor D540X 120GB + Samsung 120GB)
Series 2 (refurb), 141 Hours (Samsung 120GB)

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Registered: Mar 2003
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Posts: 14

Thanks SteveL. You probably just saved me a few bucks. . .

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MosleyH

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Registered: Dec 2002
Location: Georgia
Posts: 77

I have been monitoring my Series 2 TiVo for a month or so. First here are the results and then I will tell you what I did.

Room TiVo
Temp F Temp C Difference F Difference C Notes
70.5 32 19.1 10.6
71.1 32 18.5 10.3
72.9 33 18.5 10.3
77.7 34 15.5 8.6
79 34 14.2 7.9
75.4 34 17.8 9.9 Fan Outlet Temp 86.8F or 30.5C


What I did...
My TiVo temp was getting too high after I added a second drive and the first time I upgraded it the new drive died. I think it was heat realated. To be honest I don't remember my units temp after the upgrade but it was high in my opinion. I think 42 or 44 C. But I ended up doing the following to modify my TiVo:

1. I cut out the fan grill on the TiVo and replaced it with a wire grill available for a couple of bucks. This will allow more air flow by offering less resistance.

2. I changed my fan with a similar one from Panasonic. It's the same model but the high CFM rated one. I connected it to the same power connector as the original fan. Another solution could be to hook the original fan to a straight 12VDC.

3. I installed a Panasonic 80mm low CFM fan inside the case to move air around. The fan blows over the two heatsinks on the main board. The power comes from the main board connector feeding the rear fan. This I would contribute to the majority of my success with keeping this unit cooler.

So what did I do... I basically allowed more air to pass through the case and force air around in the case creating possitive air circulation.

If anyone needs more help I would be happy to pas on more information.

Also, my unit is out in the open and not in a confined cabinet. Since heat kills hard drives I will not place this unit into a cabinet unless it has good ventillation.

Joe

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RCA DVR40 - 105 Hours
Series 2 TiVo - 99 Hours of High Quality Recording

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Registered: Dec 2002
Location: Georgia
Posts: 77

Don't you just love formatting text...

Room TiVo Diff F Diff C Notes
Temp F Temp C
70.5 32 19.1 10.6
71.1 32 18.5 10.3
72.9 33 18.5 10.3
77.7 34 15.5 8.6
79 34 14.2 7.9
75.4 34 17.8 9.9 Fan Outlet Temp 86.8F or 30.5C


Joe

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RCA DVR40 - 105 Hours
Series 2 TiVo - 99 Hours of High Quality Recording

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Registered: Dec 2002
Location: Georgia
Posts: 77

Oh well, you get the point.

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RCA DVR40 - 105 Hours
Series 2 TiVo - 99 Hours of High Quality Recording

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Registered: Apr 2003
Location: Northern VA
Posts: 112

I see lots of posts here about heat and how it can kill a drive. But I'm also interested in hearing about another HUGE hard drive killer, power. I keep hearing how these powersupplies aren't very good to begin with. Has anyone run into problems running dual 7200rpm drives in their TiVo's? Problems I'm interested in are power related since it seems the heat issue has been well covered.

I ask this because I currently have a TurboNet TiVo NIC and a 120g 7200 rpm drive that I would like to add another 120g drive to but I'm worried about power issues. I'm starting to think I should have looked at drive power consumption more closely before getting the 7200rpm drive.

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Pictor Guy
HDR312 340 hours and TuboNET NIC
HDR312 90hours w/external modem

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