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>>> If you have a 1.3 unsubbed and want to keep it that way.... <<<

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dd9 is offline Old Post 06-03-2001 03:53 AM
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dd9
TiVo Forum Special Member

Registered: Aug 2000
Location: Boston, MA, USA
Posts: 206

Post If you have a 1.3 unsubbed and want to keep it that way....

<FONT size="5">UNPLUG YOUR PHONE LINE!!</FONT s>

Of course, it may be too late by now.

I got to thinking when I read a post the other day about someone who said they got 2.0, but didn't have a sub. All along we were told that you needed a sub for that. Well, not anymore!

I tested it with my 1.3 unsubbed unit. Connected the phone line and forced a daily call. Normally, it would connect, get account status and disconnect right away. Now, it sets the clock and gives the "Downloading...." message. I let it run for almost 20 min before I whacked it. I don't want 2.0 on this system because the manual recordings are even less descriptive than they are with 1.3.

So, just a heads up (if it isn't too late already).

I think this is rather sneaky of TiVo because it will cripple your unsubbed unit after 2.0 is installed. It's an underhanded way to force you to subscribe (for at least 1 month anyway - then you can pull the phone line BEFORE you cancel the subscription and it will work just like 1.3 unsubbed again after guide data runs out).

[This message has been edited by dd9 (edited 06-02-2001).]

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Wild_One! is offline Old Post 06-03-2001 04:03 AM
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Wild_One!
TiVo Forum Special Member

Registered: Sep 2000
Location:
Posts: 131

Post

dd9, this is not directed to you.

see people don't believe me.... and say you are wrong..

Now that you have 2.01 on a unsubbed unit make a test call to set the clock and see what it say's after it sets it (getting account status) damn SOL, I wonder why they say keep it plugged in so we can set your clock hmmm... poof!.

------------------
Now if I can just figure out how to pause my work... or fast fwd to the end of the day

[This message has been edited by Wild_One! (edited 06-02-2001).]

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Wild_One! is offline Old Post 06-03-2001 04:09 AM
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Wild_One!
TiVo Forum Special Member

Registered: Sep 2000
Location:
Posts: 131

Post

dd9,

quote,
I think this is rather sneaky of TiVo because it will cripple your unsubbed unit after 2.0 is installed. It's an underhanded way to force you to subscribe (for at least 1 month anyway - then you can pull the phone line BEFORE you cancel the subscription and it will work just like 1.3 unsubbed again after guide data runs out).


Yes but not quite... if it call's home for ANY reason it will disable that box... even on the test call. (try it)

it never used to check acct status on these but in 2.01 it does.

------------------
Now if I can just figure out how to pause my work... or fast fwd to the end of the day

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MighTiVo is offline Old Post 06-03-2001 04:15 AM
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MighTiVo
TiVotarian

Registered: Oct 2000
Location: Nashville, TN
Posts: 1700

Post

I thought we were told that we could always cancel the sub and use the system manually. Am I missing something?

[This message has been edited by MighTiVo (edited 06-02-2001).]

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Wild_One! is offline Old Post 06-03-2001 04:49 AM
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Wild_One!
TiVo Forum Special Member

Registered: Sep 2000
Location:
Posts: 131

Post

quote:
Originally posted by MighTiVo:
I thought we were told that we could always cancel the sub and use the system manually. Am I missing something?

[This message has been edited by MighTiVo (edited 06-02-2001).]



You can, but using the phone line to set the clock is a naughty thing

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Now if I can just figure out how to pause my work... or fast fwd to the end of the day

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kazymyr is offline Old Post 06-03-2001 06:23 AM
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kazymyr
TiVo Forum Special Member

Registered: Dec 2000
Location: The twinless city.
Posts: 49

Post

You can set the date on the TiVo without using the service, but of course you need to be running pppd on the serial port to do that - then you can just use one of the publicly available time servers and a time setting utility like netdate. Search the underground forum, there have been some discussions about it at a point in the past.

------------------
Confucius say: He who play in root, eventually kill tree (as seen on usenet).

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Qyv10 is offline Old Post 06-03-2001 08:49 AM
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Qyv10
Member

Registered: May 2001
Location:
Posts: 5

Lightbulb

I'm not sure if this could be done as I'm new to Tivo, but couldn't you put your drive in a computer and reset the boot partition to the other one and have 1.3 back?
I read somewhere in here that they use 2 partitions (1 active and 1 not that gets updated and then becomes active after reboot) so the update can be done without messing with the currently running setup.

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Wild_One! is offline Old Post 06-03-2001 09:01 AM
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Wild_One!
TiVo Forum Special Member

Registered: Sep 2000
Location:
Posts: 131

Post

quote:
Originally posted by Qyv10:
I'm not sure if this could be done as I'm new to Tivo, but couldn't you put your drive in a computer and reset the boot partition to the other one and have 1.3 back?
I read somewhere in here that they use 2 partitions (1 active and 1 not that gets updated and then becomes active after reboot) so the update can be done without messing with the currently running setup.



It is not quite that easy as the 1.3 and 2.01 have different MFS tables and are not compatable

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Now if I can just figure out how to pause my work... or fast fwd to the end of the day

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samo is offline Old Post 06-03-2001 05:07 PM
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samo
Senior Member

Registered: Oct 1999
Location: Littleton, CO, US
Posts: 438

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This guy found the hard way that if you don't disconnect the phone line, you'll get upgraded to 2.01 automatically. http://www.avsforum.com/ubbtivo/Forum2/HTML/006757.html

[This message has been edited by samo (edited 06-03-2001).]

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dd9 is offline Old Post 06-03-2001 11:32 PM
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dd9
TiVo Forum Special Member

Registered: Aug 2000
Location: Boston, MA, USA
Posts: 206

Post

quote:
Originally posted by Wild_One!:
Yes but not quite... if it call's home for ANY reason it will disable that box... even on the test call. (try it)



I pulled the phone cord before it finished downloading. I don't want 2.0.

I can still set the time for free and have meaningful descriptions for my manual timers.

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Wild_One! is offline Old Post 06-04-2001 03:11 AM
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Wild_One!
TiVo Forum Special Member

Registered: Sep 2000
Location:
Posts: 131

Post

quote:
Originally posted by dd9:
I pulled the phone cord before it finished downloading. I don't want 2.0.

I can still set the time for free and have meaningful descriptions for my manual timers.



I know that you did pull it before it finished, but some did not have a chance...

and when I said try it, I meant if that box ever get's the 2.01 it won't work like 1.3 durring the test call to set the clock. It will disable that box. (very sneaky, and nasty)

I do have 3 old box's that did not have (service required) printed on them and if they try to disable what is mine. I will be a very sour apple.

My new box that has this printed on it, is a different beast. Because I know now what I did not then...

We already know what happens

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Now if I can just figure out how to pause my work... or fast fwd to the end of the day

[This message has been edited by Wild_One! (edited 06-03-2001).]

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dd9 is offline Old Post 06-04-2001 04:57 PM
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dd9
TiVo Forum Special Member

Registered: Aug 2000
Location: Boston, MA, USA
Posts: 206

Post

If you still have 2 of the 3 on 1.3, why not just copy one of the disks over to the one that got updated? Now you're back to normal.

As a side note, it wouldn't be too hard for TiVo to stop 1.3 users from setting the clock for free if they wanted to. They just need to create alternate IP addresses for their nntp servers, then send the update to all subscribers (leaving old and new running parallel for a while). Once everyone has been SW updated to only see the new IP address, yank the old one. Now all the old 1.3 systems are SOL. They should still upgrade fine, however, if you wanted to 'fix' this problem.

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DMilligan is offline Old Post 06-05-2001 03:51 AM
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DMilligan
Member

Registered: Sep 2000
Location: Washington, DC
Posts: 40

Angry

I've always left my unsubbed v1.3 Tivo plugged into the phone line so that it can make it's call to set the clock (otherwise, the clock seems to lose a little over a minute a month). I never really thought it would be a problem. I only use the unit to manually record Voyager and Lonely Planet. That's all it does. Period. No need for a subscription. Those show times rarely change, and if they do no big deal if I miss them. Plus, I've been enjoying the 30-second skip in 1.3.

I come back from a week and a half long vacation and go to check the Now Playing list, only to be greeted with a series of nag screens and e-mail messages stating that I have new features. I'VE BEEN UPGRADED TO 2.01!!!

Now I've lost the 30-second skip. The manual recordings don't give the time of the recording in the Now Playing list (it only lists "Manual Recording"). I get a nag screen with EVERY PRESS of the Tivo button (this appears to be the only "new feature" added by 2.01 to an unsubbed unit). Plus, I get the terrible autocorrection of 2.01 and I CANNOT open the backdoor to change the offset and delay values because I can't get to the Title Search screen without program data!

Needless to say, I'm more than a little displeased with this turn of events. I love 2.01 on my two subscribed units and if I'd have wanted 2.01 on this unsubbed device, I would have paid for it with a subscription. I bought this little 14 hour refurb just to regularly record two specific shows at the same time each day. v1.3 works perfectly for this (with the exception of the daily nag screen). Instead, Tivo has BROKEN all the features for which I purchased the 14 hour refurb unit. Shame on Tivo!!

PS ...I don't suppose anyone would want to send me a copy of v1.3 for Philips so I can downgrade? My other two units are Sonys and the backup for them is 2.01 anyway.

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deadl0ck is offline Old Post 06-05-2001 07:25 AM
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deadl0ck
Member

Registered: Oct 2000
Location: San Diego,CA Ooosa
Posts: 0

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I was planning on backing up my 14 hour phillips when the warranty ran out in a few months. Can someone send my a backup image of 1.3 also?

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Wild_One! is offline Old Post 06-05-2001 11:34 AM
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Wild_One!
TiVo Forum Special Member

Registered: Sep 2000
Location:
Posts: 131

Post

quote:
Originally posted by dd9:
If you still have 2 of the 3 on 1.3, why not just copy one of the disks over to the one that got updated? Now you're back to normal.

As a side note, it wouldn't be too hard for TiVo to stop 1.3 users from setting the clock for free if they wanted to. They just need to create alternate IP addresses for their nntp servers, then send the update to all subscribers (leaving old and new running parallel for a while). Once everyone has been SW updated to only see the new IP address, yank the old one. Now all the old 1.3 systems are SOL. They should still upgrade fine, however, if you wanted to 'fix' this problem.



I have 4 SA's but only 1 is subbed at this time and on that subbed one I don't care if they play with it.

2 are new never even out of the box yet... Those are gifts for my family and the 4th is a conflict unit... and I am thinking of getting more. These are like potatoe chips one is never enough...


------------------
Now if I can just figure out how to pause my work... or fast fwd to the end of the day

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choccy is offline Old Post 06-05-2001 11:45 AM
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choccy
EMT Gladding

Registered: Jan 2001
Location: Ashburn, VA and Cambridgeshire, UK
Posts: 2226

Post

quote:
Originally posted by dd9:
As a side note, it wouldn't be too hard for TiVo to stop 1.3 users from setting the clock for free if they wanted to. They just need to create alternate IP addresses for their nntp servers, then send the update to all subscribers (leaving old and new running parallel for a while). Once everyone has been SW updated to only see the new IP address, yank the old one. Now all the old 1.3 systems are SOL. They should still upgrade fine, however, if you wanted to 'fix' this problem.


That's ntp. nntp is usenet news

And this wouldn't be necessary anyway.. obviously your tivo is sending tivo inc. the software version number when you make a test call etc. because otherwise it wouldn't know who to force 2.0.1 on to, therefore, it would be relatively simple to only allow tivos running 2+ with subs access to the ntp servers.

Although, if tivo were to remove the 'free' service from unsub'd users, but the hardware always lost time, couldn't the hardware then be considered faulty and in need of replacement by tivo? :&gt;

------------------
Tim 'Timmy' Gladding
Sony SVR-2000 - 2.0.1-002-010 (untouched)
Philips HDR-112 - 2.0.1-002-000 (hacked to death!)

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Wild_One! is offline Old Post 06-05-2001 11:54 AM
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Wild_One!
TiVo Forum Special Member

Registered: Sep 2000
Location:
Posts: 131

Post

Tim,

the test call is only a clock set, or phone line test...
no software can be or will be downloaded on that call....

The daily call is a different thing, that is where the software comes in... plus new guide data.



------------------
Now if I can just figure out how to pause my work... or fast fwd to the end of the day

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Skylooker is offline Old Post 06-05-2001 01:46 PM
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Skylooker
Loose Cannon

Registered: Mar 2001
Location: Chino, CA
Posts: 103

Post

You know, all of this business of TiVo rendering MY hardware useless should (and might) be against the law. This isn't like me discontinuing my DirecTV account and having a useless receiver. If I provide a video/audio input to the TiVo unit, why must it be mandatory for me to subscribe to the Tivo service? I admit, it's a slick addition but it should not be necessary to operate the unit.

IMHO, the clock should be settable through the menu and the equipment owner should be able to perform manual recordings without restriction. Of course there would be no software upgrades without the sub but that being the case they're really not necessary.

When I bought my unit I really had no plans of subscribing to the service. I found the unit not to wirk well without it and am actually satisfied with it.

Look, I'm not trying to start a flame war against Tivo but I would apprecaiate it if someone would explain to me how Tivo gets away with crippling my PVR??

------------------
Hacked Phillips HDR112 2.0.1
109 hours.

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dd9 is offline Old Post 06-05-2001 04:30 PM
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dd9
TiVo Forum Special Member

Registered: Aug 2000
Location: Boston, MA, USA
Posts: 206

Post

quote:
Originally posted by tim_gladding:
That's ntp. nntp is usenet news

And this wouldn't be necessary anyway.. obviously your tivo is sending tivo inc. the software version number when you make a test call etc. because otherwise it wouldn't know who to force 2.0.1 on to, therefore, it would be relatively simple to only allow tivos running 2+ with subs access to the ntp servers.



Um, yea. I knew it was ntp. I was just seeing who's awake.

As for the SW version, I don't believe 1.3 does anything from looking at the logs of a test call. It just connects, and grabs the time then hangs up. 2.0 was obviously rewritten to first check account status before doing anything.

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Old Post 06-06-2001 05:06 AM
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Lone Canuck
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I have two units, 1 subscribed and 1 not. Since I am in Canada, the subscription buys me nothing (no tv listings). So when I bought my second unit, I decided not to subscribe since (2 * 0) = 0.
I was suprised when the non-subscribed unit was updated to 2.0.1, didn't expect it to happen.
However, the nag screen is just about unbearable, pops up every time you access the tivo menu. Not really happy about that, since I purchased the unit while it was 1.3, I expected it to work the same way.
The nag screen is about the only thing that bugs me, I will gladly take a free upgrade, since it usually is better than old software.
I would subscribe my second unit in a heartbeat if Tivo would ever bother to offer Canadians the service (line ups).
Even funnier, the number that the nag screen tells you to call a number that doesn't work in Canada.
If anyone has a way to reduce the amount of times the nag screen appears in 2.0.1, I'd greatly appreciate it.

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>>> If you have a 1.3 unsubbed and want to keep it that way.... <<<

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