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>>> More NBC shows to start a minute early (causing more conflicts!) <<<

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laurel is offline Old Post 01-02-2004 08:03 AM
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laurel
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Registered: Feb 2003
Location: Mitchell, South Dakota
Posts: 3

Angry More NBC shows to start a minute early (causing more conflicts!)

Most of you are probably familiar with how NBC has been starting ER a minute early for months now. And they've had weird start/end times for other shows in their Thursday night lineup. This has caused folks with season passes for both CSI & ER some extra work, but one can work around that conflict.

The bad news is, while looking at NBC's schedule for the next two weeks, I discovered that NBC is now gonna start lots more shows a minute early.

Shows that will start a minute early include: Law & Order, Law & Order: SVU, Ed (after it makes the move to Friday nights), The Apprentice, Average Joe: Hawaii, and Las Vegas.

If you have season passes for any of these shows, you'll want to visit your "To Do List" and look at "View Recording History" and watch for those conflicts.

I've got conflicts myself between Joan of Arcadia and Ed, The O.C. and Law & Order, 24 and Law & Order: SVU, and lots more.

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rasheed is offline Old Post 01-02-2004 08:58 AM
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rasheed
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We already have a thread for this that can be used for reference and latest updates:

http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-v...threadid=150248

It contains all of the date/time slots where NBC time variations will likey cause SP or ARWL problems.

Rasheed

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daveyg013 is offline Old Post 01-02-2004 09:05 AM
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daveyg013
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Thanks. I just canceled my Average Joe season pass because it was too annoying to deal with. Good job NBC, you've already lost one Average Joe viewer! I'm going to give The Apprentice a shot, but it will have a short leash because of the crazy start times.

Also, as an advertiser, I'm very concerned for my client's best interest. NBC is going to be alienating some of their viewers if they keep this up. I may launch a formal complaint to them on behalf of my advertising agency and client.

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laurel is offline Old Post 01-02-2004 09:11 AM
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laurel
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Thanks, Rasheed.

I looked around for other discussions of this and didn't find any (via search or otherwise), sorry to be repetitive. Haven't had time to hang around this forum in a while. 'Course this is the sort of thing that might bear repeating or at least to be a sticky topic or something in a FAQ. Especially if becomes a regular thing with NBC (it looks like it may, unless a lot of people protest in the coming weeks).

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f0gax is offline Old Post 01-03-2004 02:06 AM
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f0gax
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Registered: Aug 2002
Location: Florida
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This is not an attack on Tivo folks. Sorry to ruin the lynching.

1) NBC has an investment in Tivo. Anything that hurts Tivo, has a negative effect on that investment.
2) Sadly enough, most TV viewers don't have Tivo or even a PVR. Does anyone really belive that NBC gains anything by pissing off a couple hundred thousand people?
3) Most people know when "their" shows are on by the major hour or half hour. They tune in at 10 PM on Thursday for ER, or 9 PM on for CSI. Long time viewers of ER in particular know that the first minute is just a recap anyway, so what are you missing? Those who watch both without a PVR are just going to watch CSI until it's over and then switch to ER.

What this appears to be is a way to make a few extra bucks on advertising. That extra minute equates to from 1 to 4 more commercials that they can sell. If that minute goes for $100,000 then over the course of a 26 episode season that's $2.6 million. Not too shabby for not really changing anything except the published start time.

I will say this though, if this idea spreads to another network, then Tivo does need to look at the negative padding solution.

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dt_dc is offline Old Post 01-03-2004 04:16 AM
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dt_dc
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Rough calculation based on the add rates listed at the following page (and a few sample recent/upcoming scheduales), NBC's few extra minutes (on shows with higher add rates) and a few less minutes (on shows with lower add rates) adds up to just a little under one million per week additional revenue:

http://www.enewszone.com/tv/news/1066114147.html

Note: The above link is loaded with pop-ups and other garbage. Apolgies. A better source (less pop-ups) would certainly be appreciated.

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SteakMan is offline Old Post 01-03-2004 04:44 AM
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SteakMan
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It isn't being done for more commercial space, they could just take a minute from inside the show.

And there is nothing "Anti-PVR" about it, they are USING the technology to force you to choose. People who don't understand padding, or just don't want to bother, will have to choose between CSI and ER. If they choose ER, their PVR will be free to record whatever is on before it.

-SteakMan-

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SteakMan is offline Old Post 01-03-2004 04:46 AM
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SteakMan
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Oh! and I bet it messes up folks that use VCR+ also.

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spanishannouncetable is offline Old Post 01-03-2004 06:26 AM
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spanishannouncetable
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2 DirecTiVos
4 different channels recording at the same time, if necessary
3 feeds for each network (locals + NY & LA distants)

BRING IT ON, NBC

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HTH is offline Old Post 01-03-2004 10:10 PM
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HTH
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Can VCR+ even handle time increments smaller than 5 minutes? Tribune couldn't for a long time.

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bsnelson is offline Old Post 01-03-2004 11:57 PM
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bsnelson
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quote:
Originally posted by spanishannouncetable
2 DirecTiVos
4 different channels recording at the same time, if necessary
3 feeds for each network (locals + NY & LA distants)

BRING IT ON, NBC

7 DirecTiVos
14 different channels recording at the same time, if necessary
0 feeds for NBC as I don't watch a damned thing on it!

HASSLE-FREE SCHEDULING!



Brad

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JTAnderson is offline Old Post 01-04-2004 12:45 AM
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JTAnderson
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I've done my part. I lowered the priority of all NBC SPs/Wishlists below those for CBS and ABC.

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TivownerSeriesII is offline Old Post 01-04-2004 02:34 AM
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TivownerSeriesII
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I have my media center PC and my ultimate tv hooked up so I have three different sources to choose from.

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TrippKnightly is offline Old Post 01-04-2004 06:31 AM
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TrippKnightly
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And still as of this posting the only explanations I've seen for NBC's actions are based on conjecture (some sound, some less so). Nothing official or authoritative.

I want to know definitively & specifically why NBC is doing it before getting all lathered up about it.

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bicker is offline Old Post 01-04-2004 06:49 PM
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bicker
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Great point, Tripp. There is no reliable information that would indicate that what they're doing isn't in the best interests of their owners.

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Peter000 is offline Old Post 01-05-2004 06:10 AM
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Peter000
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quote:
Originally posted by TrippKnightly
And still as of this posting the only explanations I've seen for NBC's actions are based on conjecture (some sound, some less so). Nothing official or authoritative.

I want to know definitively & specifically why NBC is doing it before getting all lathered up about it.

I don't give a rat's behind why NBC is doing it. I'm fairly sure they're not doing it for altruistic reasons, or because somebody's holding the President of NBC hostage. And I'm fairly sure every move NBC makes in scheduling is geared to getting better ratings.

But all ll I know for certain is that it affects me in a negative way, and that's one of the reasons why I'm watching less NBC programming.

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sinistan is offline Old Post 01-05-2004 08:42 AM
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sinistan
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What is the big deal with this scheduling? Doesn't the season pass stuff just record the start/stop time which triggers the recording when it should start? So if the tivo thinks it's going to start something at say 8:00pm, and it comes on at 7:59 relative to the tivo's clock, wouldn't you just miss ~ 1 minute. Is that a big deal? Same for vcr+ codes. I know we have a tv that has guide+ built into it (similar to tivo but free), and it also controls a vcr with a remote IR, simply telling it to start recording based on certain times. If they actually start it 1 minute or so early, it still works (at least I know the guide+/ tv combo we have does), just will miss the half-minute to 1 minute of the show. Same is true if your clock is off as well (just like manually programming a vcr).
Now, I don't have that problem with my SA tivo I got. I just don't have the sub and manually set the start/stop time recording myself. This works great for me because I don't watch that many shows and know when they usually come on. If that changes, I'll see it in the sat guide or can look it up on guide+ (or the internet).

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MighTiVo is offline Old Post 01-05-2004 08:50 AM
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MighTiVo
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quote:
Originally posted by sinistan
What is the big deal with this scheduling? Doesn't the season pass stuff just record the start/stop time which triggers the recording when it should start? So if the tivo thinks it's going to start something at say 8:00pm, and it comes on at 7:59 relative to the tivo's clock, wouldn't you just miss ~ 1 minute. Is that a big deal?


The problem is that TiVo knows it starts at 7:59 and thus the show that is scheduled from 7:59-9pm will conflict with something on from 7-8pm. Depending on your priority list one of these will not record.

TiVo has an option to record starting x min early but does not have one for recording starting x min late. I would suggest they need an option to record starting on the 30min marks regardless of official start times.

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rasheed is offline Old Post 01-05-2004 10:57 AM
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rasheed
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Most of the other newspaper guides are just rounding to the nearest :00 or :30 I noticed for NBC's schedule.

Rasheed

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smak is offline Old Post 01-05-2004 11:32 AM
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smak
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I don't think NBC is doing it to make extra advertising money on their better shows, because if ER is scheduled to start at 9:59, i'm sure that there's not a commercial at 9:59, it's probably the start of the show.

Starting a show early makes no sense really.

Now, most of the time NBC ends Friends at 8:32, which makes total sense, because they want people to stick with NBC for the weaker (after Scrubs moved) 8:30 show.

But, especially with ER, you would think that they would start it later, so the #1 show on TV ends before ER starts.

CBS should definately end CSI at 10:02 to screw with NBC.

-smak-

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>>> More NBC shows to start a minute early (causing more conflicts!) <<<

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