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>>> Does anyone feel like they are being ripped off <<<

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Darin is offline Old Post 01-15-2004 01:10 AM
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Darin
Way Left

Registered: Dec 2001
Location: Atlanta, GA USA
Posts: 1908

shaydj, we are talking about receiver fees, not TiVo fees. With DirecTV, your first receiver is "included" in your programming package. Any additional receiver is $5/month, regardless if it is a TiVo, or just a plain satellite receiver. ADDITIONALLY, there is a monthly $5 DVR (TiVo) fee if you have at least one TiVo. That doesn't increase with the number of TiVos you have - it's $5 for one, or 10. The TiVo fee is waived if you have the premium (Premiere) package.

Note that IF you have any stand-alone TiVos (TiVos that are not also DirecTV satellite receivers), they are billed by TiVo, not DirecTV, and have no influence on your DirecTV bill. They are more per month, and they DO depend on how many you have.

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rcwalters is offline Old Post 01-15-2004 01:47 AM
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rcwalters
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Simple comparison--on cable, I can hook up as many TV's as I want. Period.

I have the need for HD and TiVo together, and so it seems that my only option is to switch to D* so I can get both...although D* doesn't provide any network HD--I have to use an antenna and go OTA...that's stupid getting screwed #1.

But then of course, with three other nontivo, analog TV's, I find that I'll have to pay an extra $5 per TV per month??? They HARDLY get used...but when I want to use them, I want to use them. Why should I have to pay extra for three TV's that may get two night's use per month between the three of them? That's stupid getting screwed #2.

I'm ridiculously disappointed with the HD and Tivo options I'm finding from reading on here. So what's a cost-conscious but gotta-have-HD-and-Tivo fellow supposed to do?

I will NOT pay extra monthly for more receivers for the other TV's. I'll find some way to get around that...if possible...any suggestions?

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PrimeRisk is offline Old Post 01-15-2004 01:55 AM
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PrimeRisk
TechnoGeek

Registered: Dec 2002
Location: Denver, CO (or there about)
Posts: 565

quote:
Originally posted by Skankboy
How about any receiver after the 4th is free? They wouldn't lose much money this way and I could wire all my rooms up...


What would be their motive to do this? It generates them no income, so why would they want to do it? There is *some* cost to each additional receiver you have on your account. It has to be added to your account, if they change the security card they have to send you a new one for each receiver, and support costs. $5/month for each receiver is not too hard to handle if you have 2 or 3 receivers. If you have some mansion with 15 bedrooms and want 20 receivers, that could get a bit spendy...but if you own a 15 bedroom mansion you probably don't give a hoot about $100 in mirroring fees.

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pkscout is offline Old Post 01-15-2004 01:59 AM
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pkscout
TiVo Forum Special Member

Registered: Jan 2003
Location: Durham, NC
Posts: 1031

quote:
Originally posted by rcwalters
Simple comparison--on cable, I can hook up as many TV's as I want. Period.


Well, not really so simple.

You can hook up as many TVs as you want to get analog cable, but you have to have a digital cable box in order to get digital cable signals on those TVs. TWC here will charge me $7.61 per additional digital box and $0.34 for the remote. So it's actually close to $8 per month for each additional set. Obviously you have to *buy* the DTV tuner, but you can get those for literally nothing as a new subscriber. Given that, $5 a month for each unit from DTV isn't *that* bad.

quote:

I'm ridiculously disappointed with the HD and Tivo options I'm finding from reading on here. So what's a cost-conscious but gotta-have-HD-and-Tivo fellow supposed to do?

I will NOT pay extra monthly for more receivers for the other TV's. I'll find some way to get around that...if possible...any suggestions?



Well, in terms of cost conscious, I guess you could just wait for DTV to reduce the price of the D-HDTiVo. If you're unwilling to pay extra for additional receivers, you'll have to look at some sort of whole house distribution system. You'll have to be content watching the same channel on all the TVs and, in the case of the HDTiVo, do some finagling with the setup to get it to output on the composite or S-Video port (and get a modulator).

Now that I think about it, the cost of a whole house distribution system (if you don't have one) is probably more than the $60 a year it would cost you for the additional receiver.

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Darin is offline Old Post 01-15-2004 02:00 AM
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Darin
Way Left

Registered: Dec 2001
Location: Atlanta, GA USA
Posts: 1908

rcwalters, how do you get internet service? If you have broadband, and you have it via comcast, they charge you $10/month more if you don't also get cable video service from them. "Basic" cable is something like $13/month, so IF you are someone who also uses cable internet, basic cable only costs you $3/month extra, and of course, the channels that are available on basic are those that you don't need a box for anyway. So if you don't mind not being able to get all the premium channels on your secondary TVs, and you don't mind the PQ not being as good on your secondary TVs, then you could maintain basic cable for those sets.

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Right now, I'm so embarrassed to live in Georgia, all I know to do is laugh about it:
"I don't know how many of you have ever run over a skunk with your car. I have many times, and I can tell you, the stink stays around for a long time. You can take the car through the wash, and it's still there. So the scent of this Super Bowl halftime show will long linger in the nostrils of America." - Senator Zell Miller - Republocrat - Georgia

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shaydj is offline Old Post 01-15-2004 02:03 AM
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shaydj
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This extra receiver fee is making me think twice about getting directv. Currently, I have comcast with cable in each room, hdtv in cbs, nbc, abc, fox, pbs, and espn and a standalone tivo. Mostly watch tv in my big screen hdtv room, but watch cable occasionally downstairs when i eat.
can i call directv and ask for a fee waiver on an extra receiver as a new customer? Has anyone tried and succeeded?

now i'm not getting the great advantages of directv. dtv has a cheaper entry level price but for most people (who watch tv in more than one room), dtv is way more expensive than cable. i had no idea dtv charged extra for receiver. what the freak is the point in buying them??? why don't they just lease it then. now i agree totally with the threader. this is a huge rip off by directv!!!!!!!!!!!!

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pkscout is offline Old Post 01-15-2004 02:06 AM
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pkscout
TiVo Forum Special Member

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Location: Durham, NC
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Or as a variation (which is what I'm going to do). Distribute an OTA signal through the house and watch those few channels and have DTV only on the main one.

In my case I already have a central video distribution center (IBm HomeDirector), so I'll break out two of the cables for the HDTiVo (one will have the OTA signal diplexed in) and then distribute the OTA HD signal through the house. I have one OTA HD receiver that I will move to the bedroom and may keep an eye out for a really inexpensive one for the guest room.

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rcwalters is offline Old Post 01-15-2004 02:18 AM
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rcwalters
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Well, as far as the $60/year extra, that's for one extra receiver...but I'd need three, so that's $180 a year...unless I want to unhook the one and move it from room to room as desired. Not the prettiest solution, but possible.

As far as this home-distribution center thingy, I'd be fine with setting up an analog signal off the HDTiVo if that's possible, split that three ways, and run to each of the three plain-joe TV's. Having to have the same channel on each of the three at the same time is not an issue for me...but I'd like a remote that can change that channel from each of the three rooms. Or would I be better off with on plain DTV receiver rather than a signal off the TiVo? What options are there for a remote that works from one room, talking to a receiver in another room?

Darin, I do get internet via cablemodem, Charter, and I don't know what they charge if I don't continue with cable TV. That's another problem I guess I should label as Stupid Getting Screwed #3. Yet another reason NOT to go with satellite.

It seems that D* has not one single thing going for it...cable has it beat on every front....except, no TiVo with HD. And I guess I'll never stop whining that D* doesn't even have that...it's just set up so that in order to get HDTivo OTA, I have to switch to D* simply because HDTiVo OTA is a side-effect of having D*.

Totally bogus, man.

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feldon23 is offline Old Post 01-15-2004 02:20 AM
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feldon23
MythBuster

Registered: Mar 2001
Location: Houston, TX
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quote:
Originally posted by shaydj
This extra receiver fee is making me think twice about getting directv. Currently, I have comcast with cable in each room, hdtv in cbs, nbc, abc, fox, pbs, and espn and a standalone tivo. Mostly watch tv in my big screen hdtv room, but watch cable occasionally downstairs when i eat.
can i call directv and ask for a fee waiver on an extra receiver as a new customer? Has anyone tried and succeeded?

now i'm not getting the great advantages of directv. dtv has a cheaper entry level price but for most people (who watch tv in more than one room), dtv is way more expensive than cable. i had no idea dtv charged extra for receiver. what the freak is the point in buying them??? why don't they just lease it then. now i agree totally with the threader. this is a huge rip off by directv!!!!!!!!!!!!



I think they'd laugh in your face.

Even with mirroring, it's going to cost less than Comcast.

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Darin is offline Old Post 01-15-2004 02:37 AM
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Darin
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Registered: Dec 2001
Location: Atlanta, GA USA
Posts: 1908

quote:
Originally posted by rcwalters
Darin, I do get internet via cablemodem, Charter, and I don't know what they charge if I don't continue with cable TV.

Oh, ok, in my area, it's Comcast, so I assumed you might be the same. I don't know what Charter charges. The bottom line is, the value is going to be different for everyone, depending on what cable system you are on, how many sets you need, and what programming you want. Satellite had done a good job of making cable more competitive, and now that satellite has proven itself, and no longer has to "buy" customers by significantly undercutting cable, the two have kind of met in the middle pricewise, give or take. For me, DirecTV is actually a little more expensive than going with Comcast. But to me, DirecTV is a better service, especially when you consider the DirecTiVo combo box. You just need to look at what your needs are, and compare the two services. If Charter is cheaper, and you don't see any value in what DirecTV brings to the table, then it shouldn't be a tough decision.

__________________
Right now, I'm so embarrassed to live in Georgia, all I know to do is laugh about it:
"I don't know how many of you have ever run over a skunk with your car. I have many times, and I can tell you, the stink stays around for a long time. You can take the car through the wash, and it's still there. So the scent of this Super Bowl halftime show will long linger in the nostrils of America." - Senator Zell Miller - Republocrat - Georgia

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shaydj is offline Old Post 01-15-2004 04:20 AM
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shaydj
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Registered: Jan 2004
Location: Chicago
Posts: 22

quote:
Originally posted by feldon23
I think they'd laugh in your face.

Even with mirroring, it's going to cost less than Comcast.



Not really. Directv will be more expensive for me.

comcast cable: $36.99 basic cable, $12.75 hbo, $5 hdtv rental fee = $54.74. Standalone tivo = $0.00 (lifetime sub). extra rooms = no extra charge.

directv: $38.99 basic plus local (need local as well for cbs, fox hdtv), $12 hbo, $5 tivo, $15 total for 3 rooms. = $70.99.

Comcast is cheaper by $16.25.
Now directv gives me a few more basic channels and tivo can record two different shows at same time. But I also need to buy $1000 worth of equipment with the HD Tivo. Not sure if it's worth it right now but I'll probably give in to temptation and go with it.

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jautor is offline Old Post 01-15-2004 04:38 AM
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jautor
Also wants a pony

Registered: Jul 2001
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quote:
Originally posted by rcwalters
As far as this home-distribution center thingy, I'd be fine with setting up an analog signal off the HDTiVo if that's possible, split that three ways, and run to each of the three plain-joe TV's. Having to have the same channel on each of the three at the same time is not an issue for me...but I'd like a remote that can change that channel from each of the three rooms. Or would I be better off with on plain DTV receiver rather than a signal off the TiVo? What options are there for a remote that works from one room, talking to a receiver in another room?



I do exactly the same thing, and today you can accomplish it for under $50 (it will cost $90 to do this with the HD-DirecTiVo). You take the RF output from the DirecTV receiver, and split it to all of your TVs, just as you said. (FYI, if you want to do this with multiple receivers, you'll need a frequency-agile modulator, like one of the fine ChannelPlus models) Then buy the RR-X200 IR-to-RF remote converter from www.bluedo.com and put it inside your remote control. Boom, instant remote control anywhere in the house. Now, if you want to get fancy, buy some additional remote controls and RF extenders, and you can leave a remote at each TV (this is what I did, except 6 years ago, so I used a Xantech XtraLink IR-over-coax solution for remote control).

The HD-DirecTiVo doesn't have an internal RF modulator, so you'll have to buy one for <$50. I'd recommend the new MTS stereo S-Video modulator for $40 at RadioShack.

quote:

It seems that D* has not one single thing going for it...cable has it beat on every front....except, no TiVo with HD. And I guess I'll never stop whining that D* doesn't even have that...it's just set up so that in order to get HDTivo OTA, I have to switch to D* simply because HDTiVo OTA is a side-effect of having D*.

Totally bogus, man.



Hmmm, nothing going for it except a better channel lineup, more reliable service, generally cheaper than cable, ability to record 2 channels at once with no loss in quality (DirecTiVo), and soon the ability to record 2 HD channels at once, plus allow me to use/record OTA HD reception for no additional charge (don't have to buy the locals).

And cable is evil.
My bill will probably go down with the addition of the HD-DirecTiVo, since I won't need to buy the SD locals anymore (I can get all the OTA HD locals), and I'll drop my HD receiver after I replace my standard DirecTiVo with the HD-DirecTiVo. That takes $11/month off the bill. Oh, gee, look, that's the same price as the HDTV tier. Ok, break even...

Jeff

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Want1394 is offline Old Post 01-15-2004 04:51 AM
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Want1394
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Registered: Oct 2001
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quote:
Originally posted by shaydj
.......... Not sure if it's worth it right now but I'll probably give in to temptation and go with it.
Really don't think you should give in. Clearly, DirecTV is not worth it for you.

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Want1394 is offline Old Post 01-15-2004 04:55 AM
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Want1394
TiVo Forum Special Member

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quote:
Originally posted by rcwalters
....... I'm ridiculously disappointed with the HD and Tivo options I'm finding from reading on here. So what's a cost-conscious but gotta-have-HD-and-Tivo fellow supposed to do? ....
This is just entertainment, right? Realy don't think DirecTV is for you. Recommend you stay with what you have. Tough to be in a position where you gotta have what you can't afford.

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ElfenMagic is offline Old Post 01-15-2004 05:13 AM
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ElfenMagic
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Another thought, as I've posted elsewhere, is with doing away, or reducing, the mirroring fees for Premier subscribers. I would think that the profit margins on programming packages are greater than the margins on mirroring fees (I'm not sure on this premise, though, since there is little marginal cost to D* to simply allow another receiver access, right?)

BUT, were they to, say, do away with mirroring fees for Premier, they might get a lot of TC+ people like myself to jump up. Essentially, they'd be bundling mirroring with extra content, which would tilt me toward Premier.

For example, I currently pay $55 for TC+ and mirroring to two rooms (including Tivo cost). I'm not going to pay $98 just to have Premier, even though Tivo is included. Nor am I going to get receivers in rooms 4 and 5 as I'd like, to pay a large $65 for just TC+. But I probably would pay $88 a month for Premier if it included mirroring, (and maybe if the included mirroring was just for the two extra rooms I currently have -- that $10 difference might be right in my price point). Bottom line: if D* got rid of mirroring for Premier, they get $33 more from me a month. I can't imagine their extra marginal costs would be even close to that.

The question is how much they'd lose from current Premier subscribers who mirror...

Time for more cookies.

-EM

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hongcho is offline Old Post 01-15-2004 05:31 AM
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hongcho
.

Registered: Nov 2003
Location: San Jose, CA
Posts: 591

quote:
Originally posted by shaydj
comcast cable: $36.99 basic cable, $12.75 hbo, $5 hdtv rental fee = $54.74. Standalone tivo = $0.00 (lifetime sub). extra rooms = no extra charge.

directv: $38.99 basic plus local (need local as well for cbs, fox hdtv), $12 hbo, $5 tivo, $15 total for 3 rooms. = $70.99.

Comcast is cheaper by $16.25.



Just three things to point out.

1. The programming differences between the basic cable and the TC w/ local. There are number of channels that are different, so that could make a different for some.

2. The livetime subscription for Tivo is something you already paid, so depending on how long you had it, it may not be a fair comparison.

3. SA Tivo will incur more compression artifact due to encoding needed. That may or may not make a difference.

Anyway, I am taking advantage of DirecTV's 6 month $20/mo discount on the premium service. So far so good...

Hong.

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smak is offline Old Post 01-15-2004 06:06 AM
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smak
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quote:
Originally posted by shaydj
Not really. Directv will be more expensive for me.

comcast cable: $36.99 basic cable, $12.75 hbo, $5 hdtv rental fee = $54.74. Standalone tivo = $0.00 (lifetime sub). extra rooms = no extra charge.



That comcast charge is for the same 3 rooms, with 3 digital cable boxes?

If not, than you can't really compare 3 room analog cable with 3 room directv.

-smak-

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pkscout is offline Old Post 01-15-2004 08:49 AM
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pkscout
TiVo Forum Special Member

Registered: Jan 2003
Location: Durham, NC
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quote:
Originally posted by smak
That comcast charge is for the same 3 rooms, with 3 digital cable boxes?

If not, than you can't really compare 3 room analog cable with 3 room directv.

-smak-



I was actually wondering if that "basic" cable actually included digital. If so, he is getting a good deal, as I have to pay $55 for digital cable and $10 for a DVR. And I can't get HD unless I subscribe to digital.

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nabsltd is offline Old Post 01-15-2004 09:07 AM
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nabsltd
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Registered: Oct 2002
Location: Germantown, MD
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quote:
Originally posted by shaydj
Now directv gives me a few more basic channels
...as well as HBO in every room, which I don't think your cable company does without extra fees. Every cable company I have ever heard of requires a cable box for premium channels, and that means cable box rental for those extra rooms.

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MighTiVo is offline Old Post 01-15-2004 10:31 AM
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MighTiVo
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quote:
Originally posted by PrimeRisk
What would be their motive to do this? It generates them no income, so why would they want to do it? There is *some* cost to each additional receiver you have on your account. It has to be added to your account, if they change the security card they have to send you a new one for each receiver, and support costs. $5/month for each receiver is not too hard to handle if you have 2 or 3 receivers.


Do we know what their programming contracts are, they may have to pay more for content based on the number of active receivers.

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