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>>> HR10-250 Hands on Demo @ Value Electronics! <<<

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aaron.s is offline Old Post 04-14-2004 09:08 AM
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aaron.s
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Registered: Sep 2002
Location: Yonkers, NY
Posts: 164

HR10-250 Hands on Demo @ Value Electronics!

What a pleasant afternoon I had.....

Robert and his staff were so accommodating and gracious to allow me to play with the HR10-250 and infuse the community here with more information about this new gadget we are soon to have in our homes.

Doug has been a godsend and has created some pages to view the pictures (and video clips!). You can get to it here:

Stills: http://www.2150.com/directv/instore_hddvr.asp

Video: http://www.2150.com/directv/files/ve_visit.wmv

Now for the good stuff...... Using the HR10-250!

Build Quality:

- Seems nice and solid, just like existing Series 2 DirecTivo's

"Tivo" Functionality - 30 min. buffer and controlling programs:

- I was VERY happy to see that the HR10-250 handled pausing, rewinding and fast forwarding HD material just as well & smoothly as existing SD Tivo's

User Interface:

- Same wonderful Tivo interface. With the exception of some new menu options, the rest is the same. No learning curve to master!
- Very nice speed navigating the menus - even when unit is recording 2 shows (1 SD and 1 HD in my testing). As fast/faster than my series 1 DirecTivo.
- Guide was a little sluggish - but was only a couple of hours old. I'm optimistic that it will be at least as fast as existing DirecTivos
- Guide NOT optimized for HD or widescreen... looks/feels the same as existing Tivo's
- Guide nicely integrates the OTA channels and info

Dual Tuner Functionality:

Dual recording capability in this unit is directly tied to how many satellite inputs you are using -- or at least you have "set up" in the guided setup process. Even though you have an OTA antenna feed plugged in which is split internally into 2 feeds.

+ When specifying 1 satellite input in guided setup along with an OTA input:

You can only record 1 channel at a time. If you attempt to switch to another SAT or OTA channel you are prompted to either abort the recording and change channels, or continue watching & recording the current channel. This seems to indicate that "code" in the HR10-250 that controls the dual SAT recording capability also governs the OTA recording functionaly as well.

+ When specifying 2 satellite inputs (with only 1 SAT cable actually plugged in) in guided setup along with an OTA input:

Guided setup will tell you it is having problems with the second SAT input. But if you select "Ignore and fix later" you can finish the guided setup with only 1 SAT cable plugged in. Interestingly, this DOES ALTER your ability in terms of recording. You will get a message at the bottom of the screen indicating a problem exists with the SAT 2 input - but I was able to get it to go away by switching to an OTA channel and the going back to a SAT channel.

In this scenario, you CAN record 2 things at once.....

- Record 2 OTA channels at the same time
- Record 1 OTA and 1 SAT channels at the same time

* You CANNOT watch a second OTA channel (or SAT for that matter) even though you would think you could since the OTA input is split in 2 internally. You CAN watch a previously recorded program however. This is exatly how it works with existing DirecTivo's

+ When specifying 2 satellite inputs (with 2 SAT cables plugged in) in guided setup along with an OTA input:

Unit works just as above, but you can also record 2 SAT channels at the same time.

SD Upconversion:

I was generally pleased with the quality of the upconverted SD material by the HR10-250.... although I was quite close to the 60" plasma screen used for the demo. Is it better than you're TV? That is a personal decision you must make. I definately think it looked better than my SD Tivo's picture upconverted by my 60" Sony Grand Wega II - I will be a happy camper.

HD Downconversion to S-Video:

In this scenario, the TV then took a 480i image and upconverted it. HD material looked pretty decent -- widescreen and all -- like FOX OTA Digital Widescreen. SD content output as 480i was passable -- but no where near as good as SD upconverted by the Tivo and output as a digital signal via the HDMI output. This is also subjective and could be a factor of the Zenith's built-in scaler.

I would suspect most people will watch SD and HD over the HDMI or Component outputs scaled up to the native rate of their display... I know this is what I will be doing.

*** UPDATE 4-17-04 ***

30 Second Skip --- CONFIRMED working

Rain Fade Test:

I unplugged both SAT cables and confirmed that I was able to switch back and forth (dual-tuner) between 2 over-the-air digital channels.... the buffers for each tuner were operational (independant). Didn't test recording but I'm sure 2 can be recorded.

The message about the SAT signal being lost stayed on for a little while -- but after changing OTA channels, it eventually went away.


----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Post your questions and items for me to cover when I demo the HR10-250 at Roberts store tomorrow, April 14. I hope to get there about 11:30 am and will bring my laptop and digital camera with me.

-------------------------------
Items to cover for demo:
-------------------------------

- I'd like to see a screen shot of a Season Pass being setup. Specifically I'd like see a show that exists both OTA and on DTV's locals. Just kind of curious how easy it is to distinguish.
- OTA antenna hooked up or not. If he does can you test the signal strength?
- Take photos of inside of unit (if possible) especially around HD area (with ruler) for possible placement of second HD (bring spare HD for measurement)
- Please look for any HDTV-specific recording functionality. Is HDTV-specific support integrated into Wishlists or Season passes? Can you choose to record only HDTV versions of content?
- Is the program guide still slow on the HDTV DirecTivo?
- How responsive is the unit when recording two HD sources and viewing a third? Slow-motion viewing the third?
- How about pictures of the System Information screen complete with version numbers.
- Tune to an OTA channel. Simulate rain fade (disconnect the satellite inputs). Is the OTA signal still viewable without any problem such as overlayed error messages, etc.? Can you change channels to other OTA channels? Is the unit in any way dysfunctional for OTA use when no satellite signal exists?
- some evaluation of picture quality on SD material (480i) scaled to HD (1080i) by the HD TiVo
- Do the HD and SD versions of the same program have the same episode ID? I assume they do but would like confirmation


Aaron

Last edited by aaron.s on 04-18-2004 at 01:14 AM

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Kamakzie is offline Old Post 04-14-2004 09:15 AM
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Kamakzie
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Aaron, Not sure if Robert has a OTA antenna hooked up or not. If he does can you test the signal strength?

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dswallow is offline Old Post 04-14-2004 09:17 AM
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Aaron, user tivolovit would like a picture that clearly shows the area next to the hard drive inside the unit. If you are able to take any pictures of the unit opened, defintely get some good shots of that area, showing the amount of clearance around what looks like a metal RF box that would possibly interfere with placement of another hard drive.

For your effort, he's offering a free set of EZ-Brackets for a second hard drive that they'll eventually produce. So maybe putting some sort of reference like a plastic ruler in your shots would be good, too.

Edited: Mistakenly thought it was Weakness, but it was another person offering the brackets... here's the post with the offer: http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-v...511#post1862511


The EZ-Brackets: http://www.videoelectronicstore.com...296,c32849.html

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Last edited by dswallow on 04-14-2004 at 10:09 PM

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aaron.s is offline Old Post 04-14-2004 09:18 AM
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aaron.s
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quote:
Originally posted by Kamakzie
Aaron, Not sure if Robert has a OTA antenna hooked up or not. If he does can you test the signal strength?


I'm sure he has the ability to do so and will ask him to do so...

Aaron

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aaron.s is offline Old Post 04-14-2004 09:20 AM
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aaron.s
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quote:
Originally posted by dswallow
Aaron, the folks at Weaknees would like a picture that clearly shows the area next to the hard drive inside the unit. If you are able to take any pictures of the unit opened, defintely get some good shots of that area, showing the amount of clearance around what looks like a metal RF box that would possibly interfere with placement of another hard drive.

For your effort, Weaknees is offering a free set of brackets for a second hard drive that they'll eventually produce. So maybe putting some sort of reference like a plastic ruler in your shots would be good, too.



Doug -

Will add it to the list - and if Robert is agreeable to opening his HR10-250, I will definately take some pics of the inside and around the existing hard drive with a ruler.....

Aaron

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dswallow is offline Old Post 04-14-2004 09:28 AM
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dswallow
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Do you think you can find a couple random HDMI cables to bring with you to try?

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tivolovit is offline Old Post 04-14-2004 09:29 AM
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tivolovit
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JUST FOR CLARIFICATION???

quote:
Originally posted by dswallow
Aaron, the folks at Weaknees would like a picture that clearly shows the area next to the hard drive inside the unit. If you are able to take any pictures of the unit opened, defintely get some good shots of that area, showing the amount of clearance around what looks like a metal RF box that would possibly interfere with placement of another hard drive.

For your effort, Weaknees is offering a free set of brackets for a second hard drive that they'll eventually produce. So maybe putting some sort of reference like a plastic ruler in your shots would be good, too.



Hey Doug,

Are you sure that was weaknees? I know I made that offer, and I intend to stand by it. Good pics inside the box and I send a free set of EZ-Brackets.

Thanks,

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dswallow is offline Old Post 04-14-2004 09:30 AM
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Re: JUST FOR CLARIFICATION???

quote:
Originally posted by tivolovit
Hey Doug,

Are you sure that was weaknees? I know I made that offer, and I intend to stand by it. Good pics inside the box and I send a free set of EZ-Brackets.

Thanks,

Oops.

Sorry.

But I swear I remember someone from Weaknees asking a similar thing, but you were definitely where I'd heard the free bracket offer. Again, sorry about that!

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aaron.s is offline Old Post 04-14-2004 09:30 AM
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aaron.s
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quote:
Originally posted by dswallow
Do you think you can find a couple random HDMI cables to bring with you to try?


Doug -

I have *no* HDMI cables to speak of -- only DVI.... I'm not ~quite~ that cutting edge.....

Aaron

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aaron.s is offline Old Post 04-14-2004 09:32 AM
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aaron.s
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Re: JUST FOR CLARIFICATION???

quote:
Originally posted by tivolovit
Hey Doug,

Are you sure that was weaknees? I know I made that offer, and I intend to stand by it. Good pics inside the box and I send a free set of EZ-Brackets.

Thanks,



tivolovit -

Will do my best --- if Robert lets me inside his HR10-250!

Aaron

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jdk is offline Old Post 04-14-2004 10:13 AM
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jdk
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If you've got nothing better to do, something that's been bugging me (although I ran another line last weekend, so I don't have to worry about it any more):

Can you see what happens with just one DirecTV and OTA connection (and the Tivo settings set up for 1 DirecTV connection)? Can you record two different OTA programs at once, or just one OTA program?

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BobJ2004 is offline Old Post 04-14-2004 10:27 AM
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Cant you check out the Video Mode Switching.

I still want to Pipe the Video feed out the Coax Connector on the back to the bedroom.

Question: If I switch it to 480i mode will things recorded in HD convert down and output to coax out?

In other words can I watch HDnet shows in the bedroom via the coax if I wanted to?

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jdk is offline Old Post 04-14-2004 10:29 AM
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What coax connector?

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dswallow is offline Old Post 04-14-2004 10:53 AM
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jdk: On the sidebar of page 15 it says you do not have dual tuner functionality if you connect only one satellite in cable.I suppose you were originally hoping otherwise. If you tell the receiver you've got both connected when onyl one is, I'd expect a similar warning about searching for satellite signal all the time, too. And if you tell it there's only one, I'd expect it never could use 2. On page 6 it does say if you use the receiver for off-air channels only, you can watch from either tuner, but it also says you then have no recording capabilities, and of course, no satellite at all.

BobJ2004: there's no RF output on the HR10-250. But HD broadcasts or recordings would be converted (up or down, as needed) to the output format you select. So from page 32, 480i setting gives you composite and s-video.

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Morg111 is offline Old Post 04-14-2004 11:02 AM
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Hi Aaron,

Could you test to see how the unit choses between identical channels when recording. Example: a channel like NBC that comes off air as well as from the Sat. I want to make sure that it can either chose automatically or manually the HD source such as the one you receive from only OTA.



Thanks,

Marc

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MCodanti is offline Old Post 04-14-2004 11:39 AM
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Re: HR10-250 Hands on Demo @ Value Electronics!

quote:
Originally posted by aaron.s
- I'd like to see a screen shot of a Season Pass being setup. Specifically I'd like see a show that exists both OTA and on DTV's locals. Just kind of curious how easy it is to distinguish.


This one should be obvious, Season Passes are setup on a specific channel. So you set it up for 6-1 (OTA digital), or 6 (DirecTV)

I wouldn't mind a picture of Robert (or anyone) hand delivering my HD TiVo to me.

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dswallow is offline Old Post 04-14-2004 12:25 PM
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dswallow
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Bocktar mentioned this in the pre-order thread and it's a good test...

Tune to an OTA channel. Simulate rain fade (disconnect the satellite inputs).

Is the OTA signal still viewable without any problem such as overlayed error messages, etc.? Can you change channels to other OTA channels? Is the unit in any way dysfunctional for OTA use when no satellite signal exists?

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MCodanti is offline Old Post 04-14-2004 12:34 PM
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How about pictures of the System Information screen complete with version numbers. (You might want to block out the SN and TSN)

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chris_h is offline Old Post 04-14-2004 12:50 PM
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I would like to know if you can see the initials "KC" carved into the box anywhere Sorry, I couldn't help myself.

How responsive is the unit when recording two HD sources and viewing a third? Slow-motion viewing the third?

How fast does it "paint" the guide(s)?

Can you sneak it out in your pocket an send it to me?

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bkdtv is offline Old Post 04-14-2004 01:42 PM
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Please be sure to take lots and lots of high-resolution pictures.

Please look for any HDTV-specific recording functionality. Is HDTV-specific support integrated into Wishlists or Season passes? Can you choose to record only HDTV versions of content?

The program guide is dreadfully slow on the Tivo (so nobody uses it). Is the program guide still slow on the HDTV DirecTivo?

Did I mention pictures?

Last edited by bkdtv on 04-14-2004 at 01:49 PM

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